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High End Luxury Cars

24723 messages,  Last post on Jan 28, 2013 at 6:55 PM

You are in the Sedans Forum.

What is this discussion about? Audi A8, BMW 7 Series, Jaguar XJ-Series, Lexus LS 460, Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Volkswagen Phaeton, Maserati Quattroporte, Mercedes-Benz CL-Class, Sedan



Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.

A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.

Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.

Messages Page 1983 of 2473

#19813 of 24723 A possible error? by dewey

Oct 13, 2006 (9:21 am)

A sporty four-wheel-drive coupe and a svelte minivan called the Luxury Sport Cruiser are slated to roll off the production line in 2008.
 
There also appears to be a possible error in that Businessweek article. A AWD coupe is currently available in the form of a BMW 328xi coupe. I think what Businessweek meant is a four door coupe from BMW that will compete with the MB CLS during 2008.
 
Personally I think Jaguars would look best in the form of a four door coupe. Especially in burgundy.

#19814 of 24723 Re: Hp [drfill] by blkhemi

Oct 13, 2006 (9:56 am)

Replying to: drfill (Oct 13, 2006 6:00 am)
Doc, if you think that if Audi abandoned it's 4-cyl cars that they'll look better, well I gave you a bit too much credit.
 
The A4 is the only car currently in it's class that offers 4cyl, V6, and V8 engines with DSG, 5 and 6 speeds and the choice of 2 or AWD in the US. ALL other makes(save for the IS) come in 4 cylinder versions in their respective homeland. Even the Chinese CTS has a corporate Ecotec under the hood as the standard engine.
 
Nothing to "crow" about maybe, especially since the IS light has dimmed considerably, no doubt on anticipation for the new twin-turbo 335i sedan and new '07 320-hp A4 3.2

#19815 of 24723 Re: Audi [merc1] by blkhemi

Oct 13, 2006 (10:06 am)

Replying to: merc1 (Oct 12, 2006 9:28 pm)
Every word in your post is how I feel exactly. Their marketing campaigns are completely ridiculous in this country.
 
Why market AWD in the SunBelt?
Why market a Cabriolet in the state of Maine in January?
Why show the first 3 row SUV in your lineup without any seats being utilized, and making it worst, driving down an urban street without anyone on the street?
 
Point is, the public is mostly unaware of Audi's product north of the A4. Most have latched on to the ultra-posh A6, but the A8 has been left out in the cold. And at the rate they're going, the Q7 to the public looks like yet another SUV in this crowded field.
 
They have to seperate themselves from VW much the way MB does from Chrylser and Lexus does with Toyota. This goes for styling options, marketing, dealers, and even some engineering that was once exclusive to Audi, altho on that one, they're on the right track developing cars that will be Audi only.

#19816 of 24723 Interesting LS forum post by tagman

Oct 13, 2006 (10:08 am)

This is my recent reply to Doc on the LS board (which I rarely visit any more)
 
Doc posted:
If you've read any of Merc's posts over the past 5 years or so, you'd see what is wrong with Lexus'/LS' image/perception.
  
My reply:
Doc, to be honest with ya, I know very well about the Lexus image and some of the truth it is based upon . . . I'm just glad to see you would admit that there is an image problem with the Lexus.
  
And it is certainly nice to see you using Merc's posts to substantiate your perspective. Fascinating that you suddently agree with Merc.
  
Well, according to some of those past posts made by Merc, which you refer to and indicate you agree with, part of the Lexus perception/image problem is that they look too much like Toyotas.
  
Perhaps the two of you are right about that.
  
TagMan

#19817 of 24723 Re: A BMW Death Knell? [dewey] by mariner7

Oct 13, 2006 (11:19 am)

Replying to: dewey (Oct 13, 2006 9:07 am)
The key driver to BMW's success is their brilliant engineers. Once Lexus and Infiniti starts stealing their engineers then BMW will have no advantage over their Japanese competitors.
 
Dewey, I think that's highly unlikely. All the development engineering, even for vehicles sold exclusively outside Japan like Tundra and Titan, is done in Japan. Very unlikely many German engineers speak Japanese or want to relocate to Japan.
 
But apparently Infiniti can make BMW caliber cars using its own engineers.
 
The G's revised 3.5-liter V6 makes an impressive 306 hp and 268 lb-ft of torque. But those numbers only tell part of the story. The rest becomes clear as the G's tach needle blasts straight past its old 6600-rpm redline on its way to a genuinely usable 7500 rpm. Those extra 900 revs allow the true enthusiast some serious involvement that would never happen with a lesser engine. Like, say, the 3.0-liter straight-6 in BMW's 330i.
 
And the G will hold its own against the 3 in any handling showdown — our slalom tests show only 0.3-mph difference between the two in the slalom. Heck, I even prefer the G's chassis over the legendary Bimmer. And that just doesn't happen very often.
 
-- Edmunds editor Jacquot
 
This brings up an interesting tidbit. Ferdinand Piech, who is an outstanding engineer , a grandson of Ferdinand Porsche, and is now the chairman of VAG, told the story that when he was young, he wanted to work for Honda and wrote them a letter. But he never heard back from them. History would've changed if he had made to the top at Honda!

#19818 of 24723 Re: A BMW Death Knell? [mariner7] by dewey

Oct 13, 2006 (12:05 pm)

Replying to: mariner7 (Oct 13, 2006 11:19 am)
Very unlikely many German engineers speak Japanese or want to relocate to Japan
 
To respond to you let me repeat exactly what was posted previously:
 
Over the next decade, BMW expects Lexus and Infiniti brands to set up plants in Europe and then hire German engineers to work on building cars with BMW-like handling. Within five years, predicts Reithofer, it could be "Lexus that we will be most busy competing with.
 
Lexus and Infiniti may be moving to Germany and if that is the case they are going to be hiring non-Japanese-speaking German engineers from BMW, MB, Audi and Porshe. These engineers will continue living in their houses in Germany and will not be required to fight Nagoya or Tokyo traffic on their way to work. In terms of automotive engineering the Japanese are still not up to German standards. In other respects the Japanese are ahead.
 
Also there is not one comparison review between the new G35 and dated BMW330i that indicated the G35 is an overall superior car. Now the new Infiniti G35 will have to compete with a superior BMW335i. I think it is very easy to predict which car will end up being a first choice.

#19819 of 24723 Re: Interesting LS forum post [tagman] by hpowders

Oct 13, 2006 (12:30 pm)

Replying to: tagman (Oct 13, 2006 10:08 am)
Anybody who lines up a Camry, Avalon, ES and LS from behind can see these cars look too much alike.
It's about time that the ES and LS have a handsome distinctive look of their own.
Otherwise people like me will constantly be banging away that Lexus vehicles are nothing more than Toyotas with some upgrades.

#19820 of 24723 Re: A BMW Death Knell? [dewey] by blkhemi

Oct 13, 2006 (1:12 pm)

Replying to: dewey (Oct 13, 2006 12:05 pm)
I don't know Dewey. It appears that the line has been tightened like never before between the two arguably best in class.
 
In the November edition of C&D, the fav. mag to be talked about around here, has said that the BMW coupe's chassis doesn't feel quite as planted as the old 330i sedan, thus making it have a slight ponderous feel. The front tires no longer bites into apexes like before and give up traction way to early. The 0-60 times of both cars in manual transmission-equipped models may be identical, especially when the new G-Coupe gets here, as it will be lighter than the BMW.
 
But this is not to say it won't retain it's crown. Just not easily so like some would have it, particularly with an onslaught of new competition from Audi, Caddy, and MB.
 
It will just have to work harder. I do hope like hell they won't box Active Steering w/ Sport pkg, as this will be a virtual sucide. A 335iCoupe with SportPack, 6-speed, sans i-Drive, black/tan combo all for around $45k? Our car has arrived, as far as coupes are concerned....

#19821 of 24723 Re: Lexus to go all out for hybrids [merc1] by lexusguy

Oct 13, 2006 (1:53 pm)

Replying to: merc1 (Oct 13, 2006 2:15 am)
Hey I still like the company, but I'm a realist. I'm not one of those Lexus fanatics with blinders on who thinks that Toyota will one day be the world's only car company.

#19822 of 24723 Re: A BMW Death Knell? [dewey] by lexusguy

Oct 13, 2006 (2:04 pm)

Replying to: dewey (Oct 13, 2006 12:05 pm)
Also there is not one comparison review between the new G35 and dated BMW330i that indicated the G35 is an overall superior car. Now the new Infiniti G35 will have to compete with a superior BMW335i. I think it is very easy to predict which car will end up being a first choice.
 
The last G35 lost one comparo to the BMW in C&D, but won another on price advantage. The M45 has won every C&D comparo against the 5, on a price equal level and on an equipment equal level, so there can be no more whining about the 530i's unfair loss.
 
The inevitable G35S vs. 335i test is going to be a very close race, probably decided by 1 or 2 points. If BMW decides to send a car with AS and iDrive, they'll lose. If the BMW comes without them, it may or may not win. It all depends on how much weight C&D puts into the G's interior space advantage, superior NAV, and price advantage.

Messages Page 1983 of 2473

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