Edmunds.com | Inside Line | Auto Observer Your Account | Help | Directory
You are here:
![[F]](http://a332.g.akamai.net/f/332/936/12h/www.edmunds.com/media/townhall/webxicons/site.gif){kind=small}
Forums
Sedans High End Luxury Cars
24700 messages, Last post on Dec 01, 2009 at 12:24 PM
You are in the Sedans Forum. Your Hosts are pat & karens
Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.
A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.
Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.
|
Replying to: tagman (Oct 04, 2006 10:08 am) I understand your point about the IS being a previous slug, but where do you think the market share is coming from now that there ARE buyers for the IS? Think about it. What is there to think about? When you have practically non-existent prior year sales then increasing market share in the following year becomes a no-brainer especially with a new product! If Kia introduced a luxury model they would steal market share from BMW and Lexus no matter how sub-par that Kia model is. It is not hard to steal market share if you begin from nothing or a low number. There is nothing what you wrote that proves BMW is threatened by Lexus. Lexus does have marketing geniuses just like BMW has marketing geniuses. BMW did not become the number one global luxury company without a bit of genius. The IS350 cannot compete with a BMW335i The GS350 cannot compete with a BMW530i Time will tell if the new LS can compete with the new generation 7 series. I doubt it very much especially since the new LS received mixed reviews so far!
|
|
|
Replying to: dewey (Oct 04, 2006 10:16 am) I'm not out to prove anything! I have a theory that I have argued previously and it will either prove or disprove itself over time. you posted: The IS350 cannot compete with a BMW335i The GS350 cannot compete with a BMW530i Then why are they compared so much in all the mags? So many reviewers compare them, don't they? I think we both know which vehicles are better. I am NOT saying that the Bimmers are not better, as I believe they are. But that has NOTHING to do with competition and comparisons, and sales numbers. Whether or not the S-Class has been a better car than the LS over the years has NOTHING to do with the FACT that the LS has indeed taken market share from Mercedes. This isn't a discussion about which cars are better. I would imagine that you and I have no disagreement on that whatsoever. But I still believe that there are many consumers that will increasingly choose a Lexus over BMW, as well as Mercedes, as time goes on. For reasons of increased performance, improved styling, and perceived reliability, as well as targeted marketing. It's that simple. Look at Toyota's recent numbers. Don't you think that they are taking market share? It has to come from somewhere, doesn't it? It doesn't come out of thin air. TagMan
|
|
|
Replying to: tagman (Oct 04, 2006 10:32 am) The source of our disagreement is your above assertion. There is nothing simple about it. Especially when we both dont know what the upcoming sales trends will be? What you are saying above is that BMW cannot improve their performance, styling and reliability as well as MB or Lexus. Do you honestly believe that  Look at Toyota's recent numbers. Don't you think that they are taking market share? It has to come from somewhere, doesn't it? Yes Toyota market share is coming from Nissan, GM , Ford, and many others! Is it coming from BMW? That is very debatable. |
|
|
Replying to: dewey (Oct 04, 2006 10:40 am) Unless you are including Lexus, I wasn't suggesting that it was. I think you are missing my point. There is only so much market to go around. When it comes to Lexus, they are INCREASING their share of what is a growing pie. This simply means that Lexus' growth in share is at the expense of others in the same arena. Who do you think? Everyone else but BMW? TagMan |
|
|
Replying to: tagman (Oct 04, 2006 10:49 am) But the BMW part I disagree with 
|
|
|
Replying to: dewey (Oct 04, 2006 10:50 am) I love those Bimmers, too. And I am excited that you are getting a beautiful new twin-turbo. Nothing from Lexus there! Although, isn't there talk of an IS500? TagMan |
|
|
Replying to: dewey (Oct 04, 2006 10:50 am) |
|
|
|
|
Replying to: dewey (Oct 04, 2006 10:16 am) Then, why didn't Kia do so? Because a sub-par model won't steal any significant market share. Your argument would have held if Lexus sales went from 1 car to 2 cars. Yeah, some people would buy just because it's a new thing. But for Lexus, in 1989, it has 0 market share in the US. By 1998 it became the LARGEST luxury brand there---again, we are not talking about from 1 car to 2 cars. Can your sub-par Kia achieve the top-sales status? The fact is: Lexus had beaten a lot of German a$$es to achieved that. That trend continues today, the market share of Lexus is ever-increasing since 1989. The debate whether IS is as good as the 3 seires will go nowhere, since that's a highly subjective matter. The debate can last longer than either company can survive. However, the debate whether Lexus is gaining market share at the expense of German competitors should end here. Just go google a historic sales diagram. |
|
New? Join Now!
Forum Tools
Search Forums
Browse by Vehicle
2011 Audi A8
2010 BMW 7 Series
2008 Jaguar XJ-Series
2010 Lexus LS 460
2010 Mercedes-Benz S-Class
2006 Volkswagen Phaeton
2009 Maserati Quattroporte
2010 Mercedes-Benz CL-Class
Browse by Board
Browse by Topic
Today's Chats
