Last post on Jan 28, 2013 at 6:55 PM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Audi A8, BMW 7 Series, Jaguar XJ-Series, Lexus LS 460, Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Volkswagen Phaeton, Maserati Quattroporte, Mercedes-Benz CL-Class, Sedan
Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.
A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.
Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.
Oct 29, 2002 (1:13 am)
It's as simple as this - Cadillac has not created a car in the past 20 years or so that has become a trendsetter and copycat to other luxury brands. This is an essential for a true luxury brand that is setting an example.
Here's a few examples. In the mid 70's, the S-class, and E-class Mercedes set a standard in contemporary luxury design. It was emulated by everyone from the Cadillac Seville to the Ford Granada to some of the upper level Alfa Romeo sedans, if you want to be broader in your interpretation. The barge with the bank-like vault started with these cars.
Mercedes did it again with the 1980's model S-class and the 1990's version (which Lexus so dutifully copied with their current LS430).
BMW caused round headlights to become cool again, and the 3-series re-created the personal luxury coupe. Suddenly the CLK appeared, and Audi had to bring over a cabriolet model.
Audi's brand DNA has been copied to some extent from everything from the Lexus SC430 to the Ford Mondeo to the Proton Impian (if you know what one of those are.) If there are any two brands have caused true impact in the past decade, it's Audi and BMW.
Audi created the necessity for the clean, Bauhaus exterior, the high-quality interior which was so uncommon in the 1990's, and BMW reinvented the desire to have RWD sports sedans and coupes, whether we really wanted them or not.
What has Lexus done? Well, nothing in the styling department, but it has made the other brands learn what quality is supposed to be.
What has Cadillac done? I certainly don't see Art and Science showing up on the 2004 Audi TT, the 2005 Ford Five Hundred, or the 2005 Mercedes S-Class!
We haven't converted our E-classes to front wheel drive! We haven't installed heads-up displays in Audi A6's! We haven't seen a truck-like SUV based on the EuroVan show up rebaged as an Audi! We haven't seen carriage tops, column-mounted shifters, or BVLGARI instruments appear inside Lexi have we?
Oct 29, 2002 (9:05 am)
automotional: I believe I was talking about styling influence. The LS400 was not a styling influencer. And when I said that Lexus taught the other brands about quality, I was referring primarily to the LS400.
You do have a point. The Lexus SC430 is a hideous shape that can do the gorgeous TT no justice.
Why would I read Road and Track anymore? That's something a 7th grader reads while they're dreaming of a Lamborghini or a Camaro! I read Car, BBC Top Gear, L'Automobile, and Autoweek. Real tenets of motoring journalism.
Oct 29, 2002 (9:07 am)
I remember when the Lexus LS and the Infiniti Q45 came out. It was the Infiniti that was considered to be the cutting edge styling, not the Lexus. The grille-less front wasn't exactly new (Ford Sierra), but this car got a lot more nods for being a more noticeable styling exercise than the LS400, which just looked like a Ford aero-treatment pasted onto a Mercedes S-class.