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Sedans High End Luxury Cars
24700 messages, Last post on Dec 01, 2009 at 12:24 PM
You are in the Sedans Forum. Your Hosts are pat & karens
Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.
A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.
Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.
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Replying to: syswei (Sep 12, 2006 2:15 am) Yeah I'm sure you'd go for that.  I think in all honestly they were shocked at the LS going from 290/278hp to 380hp in one re-design. The LS has never made that big of a jump in hp before. Up until the LS460 was shown in Jan of this year the S450 was due in April along with the S600, but on the S600 showed up. Now the mags don't know what a S450 is and neither does MBUSA. I'm sure Mercedes thought the LS460 would have about 340-360hp tops and the S450 and S550 would bracket it. Then again since they underestimated the demand for the new S they could be holding the S450 back until production/demand is under control. Certain option packages (P03 for example) still aren't available on the S because of shortages. I doubt this will be the case after the LS460 arrives though. I think we'll see the S450 next summer as 08' model while the S550 gets a little hp nudge to 400 or so ponies. I personally don't think the S450 would help sales at the moment and it won't fend off the LS460 either IMO. They're doing it right this time by keeping the price of entry above all competitors until sales show real signs of weakening. Then bring out the S450 and S320 CDI. When the W220 was launched the S430 and S500 were first for the 2000 model year, and then for 2001 the S55 and S600 came out, just the opposite of the W221's launch. The S550, S600 and S65 are all here for 2007 and they'll flush out the bottom end of the S range later on. M
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From "The Independent" Online August 22, 2006: The brakes...."pedal response is snatchy and unnatural." "Techno-wizardry compromises the natural car/driver interaction. Forsaking the warmth of analogue communication, the LS has gone all digital on us." I will find out for myself about the brakes at a November Lexus "Taste", but it is the GS450h that really has me curious even though I have no interest in getting one. I know what instant acceleration is from my electric golf cart and can't wait to feel this sensation in the GSh. Too bad it doesn't get better mileage and have a larger trunk. |
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If we all seem in agreement that the S450 would be in over it's head against the LS, than why bring it at all? Just bring over the diesel as the base model, which would increase interest in a new model that is very important to Mercedes, as Hybrid Drive is to Lexus. S320/350 CDI/S450/S550/S600/S65 I think a little restraint might be in order. DrFill
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I don't think it will be over it's head against the LS at all. If it accelerates under 6 seconds gets good fuel economy and drives like the 550 but with AWD why would it lose? The awd aspect will give it huge appeal in the snow belt. IMHO Lexus missed the boat by not offering AWD right out of the gate. They seem a bit late to that party as now even the super performance oriented BMW seems to be going that route as even their new coupe will offer their xdrive.
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BMW will roll out the world's first hydrogen-burning car in serial production early next year, the German premium automaker said on Tuesday, eager to put its stamp on cars with green credentials. The specially equipped 7-Series executive cars emit only water vapor when running on hydrogen. Sounds interesting. But before I ever buy one they will have to improve their performance specs: The BMW 7 Series Hydrogen 7 Saloon is powered by a 260 hp twelve-cylinder engine and accelerates from 0-100 km/h (62 mph) in 9.5 seconds. Top speed is limited electronically to 230 km/h. With the statement below I dont think we are going to see too many hydrogen Bimmers in the near future and I am a bit wary about German attempts with hydrogen (i.e. the Hindenburg): While BMW is developing fuel-cell driven cars as well, it says it is concentrating on the combustion engine because the sum total of its features and characteristics offers the largest number of advantages and benefits all in one. Hydrogen BMWs |
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Replying to: merc1 (Sep 12, 2006 2:52 am) Exactly right. The initial interest in the LS460 will be significant. After the initial tidal wave, the S450 and S-BluTech will then offer just the right blend of S-Class alternatives. The entire S-Class line-up will be quite complete and strong at that point. I would even venture to say that the S450 will offer the competitive "value" that the LS buyers have historically looked for. After all, the LS430 was never the horsepower or performance king, but it did offer the price/feature value. Thus, the S450 may not need to win the horsepower war, as it will be more than adequate, and because those buyers have proved it is not a top priority anyway, as they are more interested in the price/feature value . . . which the S450 will deliver in spades. For those that will want more power, there will always be the wonderful S550 and well beyond. TagMan
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Replying to: topspin628 (Sep 12, 2006 5:19 am) I was surprised to see them make the 328xi coupe, as AWD coupes are obviously few and far between. It gives the TT some competition it didnt really have before. One thing BMW definitely does right is give its customers choice. |
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Replying to: dewey (Sep 12, 2006 5:45 am) That's not really fair to BMW. The Hindenburg disaster was the result of gross negligence in terms of maintenance, improperly cooled engines, bad piloting, and burning diesel fuel. It wasn't the hydrogen.
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On S Class forum there is a post with a link to news of a new S in 08 that will be a convert. Now that's some forward thinking. I can wait to see it. It looks like there might be a new trend toward some 4 door sedans with drop tops.
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Replying to: lexusguy (Sep 12, 2006 9:47 am) That's true and obvious. There is nothing similar between the Hindenburg tragedy and BMW's use of hydrogen as a fuel, but I'm certain Dewey was just kidding. Many in the automobile industry as well as certain energy companies are hard at work developing the use of hydrogen as a viable fuel and energy source. Considering the scope of available hydrogen on this planet, it makes great sense, IMO. And, quite honestly, just the thought of not needing to import oil from "you know who" and "you know where" makes my heart dance. TagMan |
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