Last post on Jan 28, 2013 at 6:55 PM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Audi A8, BMW 7 Series, Jaguar XJ-Series, Lexus LS 460, Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Volkswagen Phaeton, Maserati Quattroporte, Mercedes-Benz CL-Class, Sedan
Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.
A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.
Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.
Aug 03, 2006 (6:25 pm)
You seem awfully worried about our 1st place Lexus team, but fret not.
The IS is clearly gaining traction in the marketplace, as it's sales vs comparable BMW models indicates (6000 to 4800). VDIM is defeatable for 2007, improving road feel and ability, and I would wager a manual will appear for 2008 in the 350, around the time the 500 will arrive. I am very confident that the New IS is the 3's greatest challenge yet!
The GS will get 303HP this year, and the new V8 sometime next year, and it is able to sell with the more potent M to this point, so it is doing fine, and the future also looks bright! In that class, the M is too heavy-handed in style for me, and the GS is too soft. I would quickly take the 5.
The LX will be replaced by the end of next year, and I too hope the HPX breaks into the US.
You seem disappointed in the GX, but the people, and C&D, are much more impressed. Pure trucks like the GX are taking a hit these days. Maybe the HPX will replace it, but not because of any great failings on it's part.
And we all admit the LS will rule this country when it graces us with it's presence.
You also seem to imply that BMW knows what it's customers want. And Lexus doesn't?
BMW knows what sporting drivers want (except for iDrive). And Lexus knows what luxury car/truck buyers want.
Granted, Lexus seems conflicted when it comes to producing a vehicle more entertaining. It seems they're listening to their older clientele, and are not focused on getting 25-40 year-olds, more interested in BMWs.
The New IS is several steps in the right direction, but dropping the manual on the stud 350 does count as a fumble.
But, Hemi, the sky is not falling.
The future is, indeed, so bright, I gotta wear
#17589 of 24723 Re: Good golly! [blkhemi]
Aug 03, 2006 (6:26 pm)
Good post . . . lots more than rhetoric . . . you provided meaningful content. Thank you.
#17591 of 24723 Tomorrow is Lotus Elise day
Aug 03, 2006 (7:33 pm)
Yes indeed, I'm actually going to the Lotus dealer tomorrow to look at and test drive the Lotus Elise. I'm still interested in that car for some reason. A street legal race car . . . something for the soul I guess.
The practical side of me says to get the Cayman, but I've had the Boxster and previously a Carrera, and, frankly, while I love the Porsches, they all do look a little similar at this point, with the current look now reaching ten years!
The Elise is also eye candy, no doubt. And its performance specs are nothing short of spectacular.
I'm supposed to meet with the general manager at about 1PM tomorrow afternoon. We've had nice chats on the phone so far.
There's no telling what I'll do. I'll keep you all posted, as I promised.
If anyone here wants to offer any feedback or suggestions, please feel free to, as I am now officially in Lotus mode.
#17592 of 24723 Re: As long as BMW... [hpowders]
Aug 03, 2006 (7:34 pm)
I had a choice last year between a 545 for $721 and a GS430 for $755, the latter quote making me the envy of everybody on the GS board because they were getting lease quotes of $850 for the GS430.
And Lexus still couldn't come down to the BMW quote.
There is some twisted logic here. On one hand, many of you say Lexus doesn't have the clout of the Germans, and Lexus is lower priced to its German competition. OTOH, you see the GS430 priced HIGHER than your precious 545i. How so ? And Lexus won't deal much... They must have something good, and they know it. The LS may be lower priced, but its leasing rates are often HIGHER than the higher priced S430. Go figure... The argument of price falls flat on its face. Enjoy your 545i... God knows we've heard enough about it already...
#17593 of 24723 Re: BMW vs. Lexus is still not an issue! [dewey]
Aug 03, 2006 (7:47 pm)
So the only way Lexus will remain a threat to BMW is when Lexus cars become like BMWs and that is just not going to happen(assuming Lexus knows what is in their long term interests)!
My o my ! Are we living in rose-colored houses or what ! Lexus cars to be like BMWs ??? Gotta be kidding... Since when did BMW become the sales benchmark for Lexus to emulate ? BMW lives and dies on sales of the 3-series... Way too dependent on a single model line, don't you think ? OTOH, Lexus makes its hay on the GX, RX, ES, LS, and increasingly the IS.... Far more successful lines than BMW. It may hurt your Germancarfan pride to see how Lexus continues to cream most BMW in sales, must be that most buyers prefer Lexus to BMW, isn't it ? Maybe those buyers don't know/care squat about the drivability of a BMW, eh ?
#17594 of 24723 Re: BMW vs. Lexus is still not an issue! [oac]
Aug 03, 2006 (7:58 pm)
Say what you will, but the LS goes after the S and the IS goes after the 3. What's so wrong with that?
#17595 of 24723 Re: Tomorrow is Lotus Elise day [tagman]
Aug 03, 2006 (9:13 pm)
Saw an Elise the other day, in mustard yellow... For the life of me that car is no beauty ! I'll take a Porsche anyday... Of course you've had your fill of Porsches, so maybe an edgy car like a Lotus will be the elixir... I am not sure you can take the daily pounding on the back and knees that car will give you as a daily driver. Why not just get a Bimmer M3/5 or something similar ? Maybe even an R4/6... These cars have the driveability of an Elise, with good looks and driving pleasure. I shouldn't praise a BMW to you... But if its an Elise, good luck...
#17597 of 24723 Re: Tomorrow is Lotus Elise day [oac]
Aug 03, 2006 (9:33 pm)
For the life of me that car is no beauty !
For the life of me it sure is!!!!! And, the good news is that the touring package now available in '06, smooths the ride out a TON, compared to '05. Some reviews now say it's good enough to be a daily driver, but I'll determine that for myself. I don't need it to be a daily driver anyway . . . just an occasional driver for the excitement, thrill and fun that it eagerly provides in large doses.
Here's a shot from top gear's gallery.