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High End Luxury Cars

24723 messages,  Last post on Jan 28, 2013 at 6:55 PM

You are in the Sedans Forum.

What is this discussion about? Audi A8, BMW 7 Series, Jaguar XJ-Series, Lexus LS 460, Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Volkswagen Phaeton, Maserati Quattroporte, Mercedes-Benz CL-Class, Sedan



Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.

A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.

Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.

Messages Page 1376 of 2474

#13742 of 24723 Two Tings! by callmedrfill

Feb 01, 2006 (6:26 pm)

First, I want to mention the IS's total hotness, as I should have gave it an Honorable Mention, since I was in a discussion of general styling between marques, Japan vs. German. It is a close second to the 5-series, and better-looking than a 3, which is alright.
 
   And my #2, the sales numbers for Mercedes-Benz last month: January January Monthly YTD YTD Yearly
  Model '06 '05 % 2006 2005 %
 
  C-CLASS 3,098 3,548 -12.7% 3,098 3,548 -12.7%
 
  E-CLASS 2,465 2,725 -9.5% 2,465 2,725 -9.5%
 
  S-CLASS 923 1,064 -13.3% 923 1,064 -13.3%
 
  CL-CLASS 68 135 -49.6% 68 135 -49.6%
 
  SL-CLASS 528 677 -22.0% 528 677 -22.0%
 
  CLK-CLASS 1,126 1,225 -8.1% 1,126 1,225 -8.1%
 
  SLK-CLASS 619 881 -29.7% 619 881 -29.7%
 
  CLS-CLASS 901 778 15.8% 901 778 15.8%
 
  R-CLASS 686 n/a n/a 686 n/a n/a
 
  M-CLASS 1,962 980 100.2% 1,962 980 100.2%
 
  G-CLASS 93 88 5.7% 93 88 5.7%
 
  GRAND TOTAL 12,469 12,101 3.0% 12,469 12,101 3.0%
 
   Call me crazy, but I see a trend. Or a motif?
 
   I like the M-Class' me-too styling, but when the Johnny-Come-Lately is carryin' the ball for the ENTIRE BRAND, there is no joy in Benzville!
 
   DrFill

#13743 of 24723 Re: Two Tings! [callmedrfill] by tagman

Feb 01, 2006 (7:18 pm)

Replying to: callmedrfill (Feb 01, 2006 6:26 pm)
A little perspective please. The model line-up has gotten a little . . . well . . . tired. The new M's positive sales show that a freshening is what is needed on the other models as well, and it is coming. The new S-Class will do well and the new E and C will follow soon, but should be sooner, IMO. The new GL will be helpful with little competition, since it is a three-rower, and we've already discussed the dysfunctional flip-flop third row seats in the Lexus SUVs. The CLS will do OK, and I believe that a new SL is in the works, but again, should be sooner. So, Doc, is it my imagination, or are you hoping to see some trouble for Mercedes?
They will eventually work their way to better times with newer and even better products. Heck, they have to. (A wild card could be their diesels, if fuel prices go crazy, and if they could supply enough of the engines, but that's just a long shot.) Not the best numbers, that's for sure.
TagMan

#13744 of 24723 Re: Two Tings! [callmedrfill] by syswei

Feb 01, 2006 (7:24 pm)

Replying to: callmedrfill (Feb 01, 2006 6:26 pm)
there is no joy in Benzville
 
Somehow I think that the germancarfans will find a way to profess happiness with those numbers. Like, MB showed an increase over January of last year.
 
I guess the M-Class accounted for 982 units of the total MB brand's 368 unit increase.
 
Ummmm...maybe SUVs do count for something!

#13745 of 24723 New Year, Same Hype. by merc1

Feb 01, 2006 (7:44 pm)

Same thing every year with Mercedes' Jan sales figures. They always start off very slow from Jan-March, yet this is touted as some type of negative trend or crisis even (by some in the past). This has happened every year for the last 2-3 years on this board, yet when the year-end totals are counted up MB still posts a gain over the previous year - no matter how small it may be percentage wise. Hype lives! This hype would have you under the impression that all of a sudden buyers have turned away from Mercedes-Benz in one month because in Dec 2005 they moved over 31K units, second only to Lexus' 35K units.
 
tagman,
 
I wouldn't worry about those sales figures, Mercedes always has a slow Jan and Feb and it every years this is always seen as some type of crisis. Nothing more than hype from the Lexus camp because year after year MB's sales pick up dramatically in the spring/summer months on their way to putting MB ahead of the previous year's totals.
 
M

#13746 of 24723 Re: No Change... [merc1] by tagman

Feb 01, 2006 (7:50 pm)

Replying to: merc1 (Feb 01, 2006 7:44 pm)
I appreciate that.
 
Seperately from the stats, don't you agree that the line-up needs some quicker freshening, and maybe even a little "housekeeping" in a couple of spots?

#13747 of 24723 Re: to ljflx - good opinions and $$$ [ljflx] by merc1

Feb 01, 2006 (7:50 pm)

Replying to: ljflx (Feb 01, 2006 11:01 am)
My point wasn't a personal dig at your "tastes". I just didn't (don't) understand how the new S could be so ugly when the 1995-2000 LS400 and 2001-2006 LS430 weren't. A style question, nothing more.
 
As much as I've said negatively about the current CLK before its facelift and the Maybach, you of all people should know I wouldn't cut a truly ugly Benz product a break because it is a Benz. Did you forget this? If I truly thought the S-Class was ugly I'd be the first to say it like I did with the Maybach and 2003-2005 CLK320.
 
M

#13748 of 24723 Re: No Change... [tagman] by merc1

Feb 01, 2006 (7:59 pm)

Replying to: tagman (Feb 01, 2006 7:50 pm)
Seperately from the stats, don't you agree that the line-up needs some quicker freshening, and maybe even a little "housekeeping" in a couple of spots?
 
Sure. A new C-Class and a facelifted E-Class would help a lot. BMW and Lexus have the advantage of having newer sedans in each category, especially Lexus. As DrFill points out all of Lexus' 4-doors are new for either the 2006 or 2007 model year. That will likely translate into breathtaking sales numbers for Lexus in 2006 and 2007, but they'll also be under the gun to refresh and re-design all 4 of their sedans around the same time again in 5-6 years. BMW has a similar situation with their oldest sedan being around from "only" 2002, while the outgoing S-Class goes back to 1999. What other changes do you think they should make? This will be a big year for MB even without and all new E or C-Class. Everything else either gets a facelift or new engines that will account for a better than average (for the last few years) sales gain over 2005 IMO.
 
M

#13749 of 24723 Some perspective... [tagman] by scott1256

Feb 01, 2006 (8:01 pm)

Replying to: tagman (Feb 01, 2006 7:18 pm)
Mercedes sales were up 3% in January over a year ago. The new S along with the restyled SL and E should add volume later in the year. MB will IMO have a good year.
 
Luxury cars are selling! In January Lexus cars were up 36.9%, Cadillac cars up 33.4% and BMW cars up 23%.
 
Truck sales for Lexus, Cadillaac and BMW were weak in January.

#13750 of 24723 Re: to ljflx - good opinions and $$$ [merc1] by ljflx

Feb 01, 2006 (8:41 pm)

Replying to: merc1 (Feb 01, 2006 7:50 pm)
Where do you see me using the word ugly. I said I didn't like it but I also said I thought the car had a beautiful silhouette but was overdesigned and henced being overdesigned ruined its looks. The overdesign is in the wheel arches and the trunk. Too many parts calling for attention can ruin a cars design just like spoiled superstars can disrupt a team that is great on paper. The flow is lost. That's how I feel about this S - take out the arches and fix the trunk and the car would look great to me. I don't find the car to be ugly - I just don't find it to be good looking.

#13751 of 24723 Re: No Change... [merc1] by ljflx

Feb 01, 2006 (8:53 pm)

Replying to: merc1 (Feb 01, 2006 7:59 pm)
"As DrFill points out all of Lexus' 4-doors are new for either the 2006 or 2007 model year. That will likely translate into breathtaking sales numbers for Lexus in 2006 and 2007, but they'll also be under the gun to refresh and re-design all 4 of their sedans around the same time again in 5-6 years."
 
But technically there's a weakness in your argument as it that means Lexus just went through the period you're theorizing about in the future (correctly in all likelihood) with very healthy growth. In truth the real answer continues to be something that MB missed - the SUV phase. Lexus can much better balance out its line-up changes because of the the vehicles that many here so often want to exclude - SUV's. Stale cars - new suv's; stale SUV's - new cars; plus a strong wildcard - hybrids. In the US they have much better balance than MB right now and it shows clearly in the sales numbers and what happens when models go stale. My instinct also tells me that if Lexus rolls out a minivan it will do a lot better than the R-class. The issue for them though is the fear that it might cannibalize the RX.

Messages Page 1376 of 2474

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