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Sedans High End Luxury Cars
24702 messages, Last post on Dec 17, 2009 at 10:48 AM
You are in the Sedans Forum. Your Hosts are pat & karens
Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.
A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.
Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.
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| Never though id see the day when people would say Lexus is as good as Mercedes-Benz or BMW | |
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Replying to: michael_mattox (Jan 21, 2006 2:23 pm) CR has recently upgraded the 5 series to satisfactory reliability. Writing from my own experience, I have had 3 BMW's since 1993 and have only had to have regular oil changes paid for by BMW, and of course, new tires. I don't believe I am the lucky exception to the rule here. BMW had a reliability problem. They listened. They fixed it. |
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Replying to: garyh1 (Jan 21, 2006 4:27 pm) IF,IF,IF,IF,IF . . . his surmise is correct . . . then I must say the "value" equation would be altered! Now, IF, IF, IF, IF, IF the "value" factor changes, then we can further surmise that the Lexus buyer will weigh less on the "value" as it relates to the historic price advantage. That, therefore leaves the "other" factors related to the buying decision. Well, that leaves "reliability" itself. That's pretty much the majority of what you hear from the "Lexus camp" nowadays. To me, that's important, but it's "thin ice", if it becomes the ONLY factor by itself. The other HELM's are generally considered reliable "enough" to be considered by prospective buyers, that's for sure, and the styling and/or handling advantages of the other HELM's need to be considered, of course. The "new" model factor always helps, so we can expect that to assist the sales of the S-Class and the LS for a while. In the long run, I think Lexus can in fact close the price gap, somewhat, due to their historic sales momentum, social acceptability of their cars, and "reliability" statistics . . . but I do not think that those factors are enough for Lexus without a "noticeable" price advantage. If the prices were about the same . . . yes, there would be those that would still buy the Lexus, of course, but, IMO, those numbers would SHRINK, and more buyers would then choose the other HELMs as the preferred choice. Let me conclude, though, by saying that I do NOT actually believe that Lexus will give up their price advantage, and that they KNOW very well what their formula for success is here . . . and you can expect them to continue with their winning and BRILLIANT formula for years to come. Hence, the Lexus price advantage MUST stay. TagMan
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Replying to: tagman (Jan 22, 2006 9:33 am) On the business side there is another important thing to consider here. Many of the same people own these prestigious brands as dealerships. But the Lexus dealerships are far more profitable than the MB dealerships. There are a number of reasons for this including the much better price elasticity Lexus gives their dealers on MSRP to dealer cost. We all should know well the power of the retailer in the distribution chain of any business segment and cars are no exception. I would expect the MB dealer network to bring a lot of pressure on MB for changes in the years to come and they will use Lexus as a big wedge. |
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Replying to: tagman (Jan 22, 2006 9:33 am) |
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I just saw the new 2007 S class in person and was quite disappointed. The body shape doesn't look any better up close than it does in person. And I'm not a big fan of these "ATM" dashboards that seem to be growing in popularity. Mercedes stays on the path of poorly stlyed cars that reek of Chrysler and Cadillac Give me the current Audi A8 all day long over any new body style S class.
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Replying to: ljflx (Jan 22, 2006 10:04 am) I understand your points that are well taken, but I still think that the price advantage needs to be perceived by the buyer. Even if it translates to leasing programs that favor the Lexus for high residual values and smaller depreciation payments. So, yes, as the gap might close, there would still be buyers. Heck, if the Lexus was MORE expensive there would still be buyers (enough of them? that would need to be determined IF IF IF the gap is truly closed) . . . but in my opinion, the wider the gap (less expensive the Lexus is) = more Lexus units sold. And I believe Lexus will continue to embrace that (price advantage) strategy. OMG, I need to be thinking about football! TagMan
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Replying to: rjlaero (Jan 22, 2006 10:44 am) ?????????????????????????????????????????????  
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Replying to: tagman (Jan 21, 2006 3:45 pm) |
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Replying to: tagman (Jan 22, 2006 10:53 am) I not sure of the exact year, but I think it was somewhere between model years 1996 (when the new W210 came out) and 1998 (when they switched from the I6 to the V6). They wanted to be able to advertise it to appeal to a larger audience, and decided to cut the MSRP. I know when I bought an E in '94 there was a ton of negotiating room, but when I got my next one in '98 they were selling very close to MSRP, although the net price did not go up very much. |
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