Last post on Jan 28, 2013 at 6:55 PM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Audi A8, BMW 7 Series, Jaguar XJ-Series, Lexus LS 460, Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Volkswagen Phaeton, Maserati Quattroporte, Mercedes-Benz CL-Class, Sedan
Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.
A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.
Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.
#13302 of 24723 Re: MB, BMW?? what else you have? [hpowders]
Jan 15, 2006 (4:13 pm)
2004? Who cares about 2004? Who's looking backwards?
That's ancient history in this dynamic business.
Of course its history bcos your German car brands lost to the LS430... Figures. These are auto rags who love the German cars but are objective enough to declare the LS430 as top notch among its peers.... Bitter pill for some German car fans to swallow, no doubt. BTW, the current 2006 versions of these cars are mostly the same, with a few engine upgrades (745 --> 750). So what's really different between MY2004 and MY2006 for the HELM comparo ??? You tell me...
#13303 of 24723 Re: Quick LS interior analysis [garyh1]
Jan 15, 2006 (4:28 pm)
Gary - I feel the same way you do. Sometimes I'm fumbling for the seat heater buttons and a few other things. But having experience with the current car and the RX I know full well you never will see that view of the first image Dman posted - unless you get into the car on your knees.
#13304 of 24723 Re: MB, BMW?? what else you have? [dewey]
Jan 15, 2006 (4:30 pm)
Please tell me another manufacturer that offers such a smooth I6?
Toyota offers an I6. Was in the IS300 as recent as MY2005. This engine is silky smooth, but old technology compared to the new direct injection V6 in the IS350. More fuel efficient, more tunable, and newer more modern technology... Out with the old, buddy... This is 2006 !
#13305 of 24723 Re: Quick LS interior analysis [garyh1]
Jan 15, 2006 (4:30 pm)
Actually, I think Len was right the first time on this issue. First, I have to say that we haven't actually sat in the new car yet, so we are really all just speculating. And certainly, as designman said, pictures can lie. But the low perspective of the first pic is not one that the driver would ever see to create any impression.
Well there’s really no right and wrong here. I was just giving my impressions and opinion. Let me put it this way. I pretty much know exactly what I see in photos, can parse the jump from 3D to 2D and can judge the technical details involved—size, proportion, dimension, scale etc. What I am saying is, according to what I see in the photos, I know almost exactly what I am going to see and the ambience I am going too feel when I sit in that driver’s seat. I am in no way speculating in this regard. Now, others may need to do it live but trust me, I don’t. 99% of the time I know what I am going to see live. You will rarely if ever hear me say it looked one way in the photos and another way live. For all intent and purpose, I HAVE sat in the front seat of the LS460. Same goes for the exterior—I have seen it live. Same with the MB S. By the time they actually get here, they're a year old already.
The only thing we really can’t judge from the photos is textures, material quality, build quality, the fine distinctions in color etc. But I never give opinions on these aspects at this stage.
However let's not confuse physical perception with aesthetic opinion. They are very separate.
#13306 of 24723 Re: MB, BMW?? what else you have? [oac]
Jan 15, 2006 (4:52 pm)
Offered. The 2JZ-GTE Supra\SC\IS\GS motor has finally been put to rest with the new IS. Also, Jaguar used to have some wonderful I6 engines. In 2006 though, BMW is pretty much the last one, everybody else uses V6s or flat 6s now. I6s are just not space efficient.
#13307 of 24723 Re: MB, BMW?? what else you have? [dewey]
Jan 15, 2006 (4:55 pm)
there is far more casio watches than rolex!! but you can not compare things in this way, compare in the same segment, Tissot is not in the same league as the omega, and dont forget the material, diamonds and so, its not ABC its complicated, but Lexus do sells more than MB thats for sure, is it better becoz it sells more, no i disagree but yes it better becoz it has better quality, features and so, in other words, if you are measuring how succeful a car is by its sales, then MB is better than Lexus is europe!! no, things wont go this way, the sales are adjuvant to the other things the car has, thats what makes a good car not only sales, but sales show how succeful it is.
back to the story of who is cheaper, do u think that a lexus buyer can not buy a MB or BMW? i bought a lexus not becoz i dont have the money to buy others, becoz i liked the car, and one more important point here, why do MB sells lesser cars for a higher price!! isnt that cheating? why do lexus offers far more options for lesser price, lexus quality is better, engineering is better, options is better, and far more reliable? so whats with the germans?
iam not saying MB, BMW are bad, but lexus is much better at least IMHO, and back to the same thing, ppl are different, that why both lexus, MB are selling good, not becoz lexus sells cheaper cars, hmm what about cadillac or infiniti both have lesser prices? do they sell more?? NO, why? becoz Lexus is the BEST in IMHO
Lexusization of the WORLD
#13308 of 24723 Do The French Make Luxury Cars?
Jan 15, 2006 (6:06 pm)
I mean, we don't see them i the USA-but surely Peugeot, Renault, Citroen must market lines of luxury cars-what are they? Does Citroen still make limousines for the President of France? Or do French bigwigs drive Mercedes? (sacre bleu!)?
#13309 of 24723 Re: MB, BMW?? what else you have? [oac]
Jan 15, 2006 (6:08 pm)
As to I6 engines, what makes u conclude as such ? Pls speak for yourself, don't rope me into the "I have no expertise" excuse....
In that case let me repeat my question to you: What i6 compares to the current BMW i6 engines? And please dont give me a history course about the outdated IS300 engines. The current BMW i6 is very unique! I just wanted to inform you, that's all.
Thanks for letting us know. Unfortunately, this is NOT a sport sedan forum, so what do we make of your past & present contributions ???
This forum is about viewpoints on HELMs and has nothing to do with my motives and intentions for being here. As a LPS fan I am here for a logical reason but I dont have to disclose my reasons to you or anyone.(Hint: auto buying decisions also involve spouses).
#13310 of 24723 Re: MB, BMW?? what else you have? [lexusguy]
Jan 15, 2006 (6:22 pm)
I6s are just not space efficient.
Yeah that is one disadvantage. But you forgot to mention the advantages of i6 engines. I6 engies are more effient and smoother than v6s. That counts for something, dont you think?
#13311 of 24723 A Question?
Jan 15, 2006 (6:31 pm)
Question to Lexicans:
If the LS430 is close to being as good as an MB S or a BMW 7 series, then why are LS sales so crappy in Japan itself? Could it be because the Japanese are not crazy about LS cars that resembles the ideal concept of what a 21st Buick should be like! Is it not that the LS is a soft American definition of what a luxury car should be? Unfortunately the LS does not fulfill the worldwide definition of what a luxury car should be! The MB S and BMW 7 series does fulfill that defintion bang on!!