Last post on Jan 28, 2013 at 5:55 PM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Audi A8, BMW 7 Series, Jaguar XJ-Series, Lexus LS 460, Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Volkswagen Phaeton, Maserati Quattroporte, Mercedes-Benz CL-Class, Sedan
Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.
A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.
Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.
#12334 of 24726 Re: Jaguar and Others [blckislandguy]
Dec 26, 2005 (4:57 pm)
While I haven't read the study nor even seen excerpts in trade journals, it seems to me, albeit a Jag fan, that yes, this study is quite clearly a proxy for resale value. Maybe in fact owner retention rate is the best predictor of resale in the future. What causes good resale, among other things, is high retention. The retention rate is a driving dynamic in this.
I'll have to disagree.... If that were the case, then Chevrolet would have the 4th highest resale, Hyundai the 5th highest, Ford the 6th highest, and Cadillac the 7th highest. We all know that those are definitely not cars with high resale.... Also note that Infiniti is near the bottom of this study, but I don't believe their resale is that bad.
J.D. Power and Associates 2005 Customer Retention Study
#12336 of 24726 Re: How little has change in 35 years! [brightness04]
Dec 26, 2005 (4:59 pm)
While I'm open to the idea that MB is subsidizing the S Class, I'd really like some proof (e.g., Edmunds TMV?) that one can pick up a new S Class for less money than a Lexus LS. The costs may even out because of depreciation when you factor in the TCO data over 5 years but I'm not convinced that a LS is more expensive to acquire.
#12337 of 24726 Re: How little has change in 35 years! [blckislandguy]
Dec 26, 2005 (5:32 pm)
I have seen several S350 ads showing less than $450/mo lease deals. As far as I know, there is no way you can get LS for that little outlay.
#12338 of 24726 Re: Jaguar and Others [bdr127]
Dec 26, 2005 (5:41 pm)
Retention rate I think does predict resale if one compares apples to apples. Clearly, Chevrolet-largely a truck/large SUV line, has a superior resale to Ford -again largely a truck/SUV line.
Infiniti-resale is an oxymoron.
#12339 of 24726 Re: Jaguar and Others [fenn]
Dec 26, 2005 (5:42 pm)
Even if you lease, you're still going to get killed if you get a new Jag. Now that Jaguars are basically reliable cars, the best thing to do is to buy them at 3-4 years old. By 2007, a '04 XJ8 will have lost some 2\3 of its value, and you'll be able to buy it for less than the price of an X-type. You can buy a '98 XK convertible for the price of a Honda Civic. Not even A8s are that bad.
#12340 of 24726 Re: Jaguar and Others [bdr127]
Dec 26, 2005 (7:11 pm)
#12341 of 24726 Re: How little has change in 35 years! [brightness04]
Dec 26, 2005 (7:16 pm)
No it does not. Reviews have not bemoaned about LS not haing MB handling or ride for years. It has had a cushier ride than MB since 1989, and outhandles S class since 1998. The price difference has not been an issue lately either, as it is actually more expensive to acquire an LS than a low-level S, given MB's subsidies.
A MB S350?
What continent do you live in? Does North America actually sell MB350s? What part of the world are your reviews from, expecially the ones comparing a MB350 versus a LS430. It would be interesting to know since the LS430 is not taken seriously anywhere else in the world but North America.
That is not current either. The successor to 2800CS is the 5 series. A 6-cyl 5 series can be leased for little over $500/mo, well within means for mere motals.
What royalty do your mortals belong to ? The House of Saud? The successor to a 2800CS is a BMW 6 series. Also 8 thousand dollars spent on a BMW 2800CS during 1970 was not exactly an immortal act.
#12342 of 24726 Re: The Union Jack [rjlaero]
Dec 26, 2005 (9:24 pm)
MB has sold about 13k of the new CLS's this year, so that can be called a success, and the ML is still doing quite well. But with those 4 lines shown above, it's a loss of 15,483 cars over the same time in 2004 for Mercedes.
The whole purpose of having new models like the CLS is to increase market share and penetration. But when you lose nearly 16k cars in the other direction, that's not good.
I'm fully aware of the sales numbers. Like Dewey stated, MB should see a bigger improvement next year when some of their core models get some attention (E and S). The only Mercedes introduction that hasn't gone well this year is the R-Class, for good reason IMO.