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High End Luxury Cars

24723 messages,  Last post on Jan 28, 2013 at 6:55 PM

You are in the Sedans Forum.

What is this discussion about? Audi A8, BMW 7 Series, Jaguar XJ-Series, Lexus LS 460, Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Volkswagen Phaeton, Maserati Quattroporte, Mercedes-Benz CL-Class, Sedan



Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.

A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.

Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.

Messages Page 1143 of 2473

#11417 of 24723 Re: continuation [designman] by oac

Nov 22, 2005 (5:07 pm)

Replying to: designman (Nov 22, 2005 4:47 pm)
BMW is strong and I believe their 4-year free maintenance is a big part of the reason, not to mention it's the ultimate driving machine.
 
That 4-yr *free* maint is built-in, isn't it ? The ultimate driving machine remains a marketing jargon, albeit a good one since many people actually believe it and live it.
 
Let's see: Since we are quoting KBB, how 'bout this actual KBB real-world test. We sample two cars, a BMW and a Lexus, in same market space, say the GS300 v 528i. Pick a year, say 2000 MY. Same mileage, about 50K miles. Similar level of features. Which car would you expect to re-sell higher at dealer trade-in value ?
 
Let's see what KBB says about such a scenario:
2000 528i, Good condition: link title
 
2000 GS300, Good condition: link title
 
Hmmmmmm !!!! Which one is higher priced as a used car ???? Note, this is KBB trade-in value.

#11418 of 24723 Qualify That! by hpowders

Nov 22, 2005 (5:22 pm)

BMW may be the Ultimate Driving Machine in its particular price category.
None of them can compete with Porsche's best.
 
And frustratingly, no BMW or Porsche, for that matter can core a apple.

#11419 of 24723 Re: continuation [oac] by dewey

Nov 22, 2005 (5:23 pm)

Replying to: oac (Nov 22, 2005 5:07 pm)
!Let's see what KBB says about such a scenario:
2000 528i, Good condition: link title
  
2000 GS300, Good condition: link title
  
Hmmmmmm !!!! Which one is higher priced as a used car ???? Note, this is KBB trade-in value.
 
Among several model years you are selectively choosing among various models just one instance where a Lexus beats a BMW in terms of resalue values.
 
Seems a bit desperate!

#11420 of 24723 Re: continuation [dewey] by ljflx

Nov 22, 2005 (5:42 pm)

Replying to: dewey (Nov 22, 2005 5:23 pm)
Doesn't anyone realize that the future resales cited are based on the lease residuals offered? Subsidize the lease and you get rewarded. Don't subsidize the lease and you get penalized. This stuff can almost be considered marketing costs. I'll say it again - in 2001 the S500 was supposed to retain 68% of its MSRP based on my lease after 3 years and 36K miles. It probably won the award that year for future resale value. Unfortunately 3 years later it retained under 50% and finished in the cellar in the real world of retention values. No need for any Lexicans to scramble. Just check Edmunds real TMV's of used cars rather than the fantasy future values cited. Lexus and BMW are the leaders (interchangably on different models) and Audi and MB are the cellar dwellers.

#11421 of 24723 Re: continuation [hpowders] by oac

Nov 22, 2005 (5:45 pm)

Replying to: hpowders (Nov 22, 2005 4:54 pm)
I wonder if you would be combing through the "not-so-small print" if the outcome was a little different, uh, maybe in favor of the Lexicans?
 
When people throw out links purportedly supporting a theory of theirs, it behoves the reader to actually read what is being linked and understand what it means. So I did what anyone should do - read the document linked. I bet those who threw the links at us may not have read the entire document...

#11422 of 24723 A Wish by hpowders

Nov 22, 2005 (5:46 pm)

Even though I am admittedly a BMW fanatic, I do hope the 2007 LS doesn't let me down the way the 2006 GS did after being touted as a "BMW 5 series killer" and was nothing of the sort.
 
If you can believe some of those photos going around, the new LS will be improved quite significantly in the looks dept.
Now if only Lexus will make a serious attempt to put a bit of fun in the handling dept.
If they do, I will be taking a serious look and test drive.

#11423 of 24723 Re: continuation [dewey] by oac

Nov 22, 2005 (5:49 pm)

Replying to: dewey (Nov 22, 2005 5:23 pm)
Among several model years you are selectively choosing among various models just one instance where a Lexus beats a BMW in terms of resalue values.
  
Seems a bit desperate!
 
I just picked an example. Rather than casting aspersions on people, why not do your own research, pick any other model year & car combo of your choice and see what you get, eh ? BTW, read Len's post #11420... seems to nail it.

#11424 of 24723 Re: continuation [ljflx] by hpowders

Nov 22, 2005 (6:04 pm)

Replying to: ljflx (Nov 22, 2005 5:42 pm)
Judging from the BMW and Lexus leasing figures, BMW with its high residuals and competitive money factors and relatively poor long-term reliability encourages one to lease and Lexus with its ridiculously low residuals (totally out of touch with reality), rather high money factors (except in December, yes I remember!) and incomparable long term reliability encourages one to buy.

#11425 of 24723 Re: continuation [hpowders] by oac

Nov 22, 2005 (6:08 pm)

Replying to: hpowders (Nov 22, 2005 6:04 pm)
Judging from the BMW and Lexus leasing figures, BMW with its high residuals and competitive money factors and relatively poor long-term reliability encourages one to lease and Lexus with its ridiculously low residuals (totally out of touch with reality), rather high money factors (except in December, yes I remember!) and incomparable long term reliability encourages one to buy.
 
Ahhhhh !!! This is why you gotta understand what is being peddled in these *awards*. Projections and reality are NOT always the same. You should ask those who told us we'll be greeted with flowers in Baghdad...

#11426 of 24723 Re: continuation [ljflx] by dewey

Nov 22, 2005 (6:39 pm)

Replying to: ljflx (Nov 22, 2005 5:42 pm)
Can anyone prove that the subsidies of a average Lexus lease are less than a BMW lease?
 
And if nobody can prove the above point then nobody can claim that the residuals of BMWs are highest as a result of far more generous lease subsidies!

Messages Page 1143 of 2473

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