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Sedans High End Luxury Cars
24700 messages, Last post on Dec 01, 2009 at 12:24 PM
You are in the Sedans Forum. Your Hosts are pat & karens
Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.
A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.
Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.
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Replying to: ljflx (Nov 15, 2005 7:51 pm) This isn't totally correct. Mercedes dropped prices of the S-Class in 1999 (for the 2000 MY) because the previous car was seen as too big, overweight and too expensive in certain markets so they shifted direction. This had very little or nothing to do with Lexus. Lexus' LS wasn't even a factor back in 1999. That duller than dull 1995-2000 LS was barely even in S-Class price territory when the W140 S-Class was out and the 2000 S-Class with its price drop still wasn't near the price of a 1999 LS400. Mercedes dropping prices across the board compared to just the S-Class, happened for 1994..that was in response to Lexus and market conditions in general. The 2000 S-Class was a radical departure compared to the previous tank-like S from 1992-1999. M |
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Replying to: merc1 (Nov 15, 2005 10:06 pm) TMC may be on the verge of becoming the world's #1 automaker, but Lexus has a long way to go before becoming the #1 luxury brand.
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Replying to: lexusguy (Nov 15, 2005 10:30 pm) I think they'll be ok once everything they've got planned finally gets over here. I really don't think VW is serious enough about the U.S. market. They take their sweet time in getting products over here when they've been out in Europe for over a year. They need a cheaper base V6 Passat and some restructuring of the Passat's option packages and/or more stand alone options. Potential VW buyers are complaining about not being able to get a manual with the V6. Hello VW? VW buyers like "stick shifts". The Jetta needs a more powerful/refined base engine. Half of the Gallard's V10 my arse! It sure doesn't act or sound like it. There should 276hp "R36" versions of the Jetta, Golf and Passat. In the case of the Passat I'd turbocharge the V6 for 340hp. I don't know how they could do it with the current exchange rate, but they need to adjust prices badly. A Jetta can run over 30K now! I couldn't believe it. Toyota becoming #1 is just a continuation of the long nightmare GM and Ford have been living with for years. I actually feel sorry for GM somewhat now, after years of bashing them. They're just too big with too many of the same models that simply don't move the game on in any way other than creative price incentives. I'm not worried about Ford, they've proven before that when they're backed into a corner they come out swinging. Now since they've got Volvo, Land Rover and Aston up and running maybe they can concentrate more on their core brand. M
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I know I have often picked bones with MBs, highlighting areas I think they are short on. But as an LS owner, I'd like to highlight areas of my car I'd like to be better. My 1999 came into service Nov 15, 1998, a full 7 years of operation today. It has 109K miles to show for it. 1) I've got a broken windshield that I cannot get a non-Lexus replacement for. Turns out no one makes the glass anymore, except one through Toyota. That stinks, cos its gonna cost me $700 to replace. 2) My right tail-lamp is out. Well, 'bout time too. Just went out, so I gotta check on cost. I hope it isn't much  3) My read-out says "Low washer fluid" but my washer fluid is not low. Lexus says its a bad electrical. Cost to diagnose and fix is $200. Seems like a lot for a bad fuse, imo. 4) BTW, I hope Lexus re-design the trunk lid to open all the way all the time, instead of the two-step one. Cos I've bumped my head a few times already, and it hurts. I know, clumsy me... But I gotta have something to complain about, right ? Well, that's all the imperfections my car currently has. I am anxious to see the 2007 LS460, finally I can retire this baby and pass it on to my daughter. Trouble is she doesn't want the LS, so I am stuck... Get rid of it, or keep it ? What a problem to have, eh ? Anyone need a fairly well used but still reliable LS?
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Replying to: merc1 (Nov 15, 2005 9:35 pm) Merc1, I am sure you know the answer to this. A RWD is a better driving car than a FWD car, everyone knows that already, else *most* sport sedans/coupes will be FWD, eh ? Why not drive the LS in the sport-mode and then drive the new Avalon and tell us which drives better? Maybe you'd be surprised. Many look at the LS and think it drives as it looks. You'll be plenty surprised... The LS is quite nimble for a big car. Drives real well, and steering may be a tad numb but still responsive enough. In sport mode, you get a lot more road feel (than a typical LS), and the handling is even better, all for a big full-size luxury cruiser. There is hardly any major difference b/w the S and the LS in driving and road isolation. Have you read the Nov C&D review on a short drive of the 2007 S500 ? Was it glowing ??? I'd say not. With a Maybach exterior, exaggerated rear wheel flares, and the BMW-interior, hmmm ! who knows how it will be received when it arrives here next spring ?
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Replying to: oac (Nov 16, 2005 3:59 am) The LS430 isn't a sport coupe or sports sedan, or a sporty anything. What difference does RWD make in a car like a LS430 when handling isn't a priority? There aren't any hi-hp models based on the LS that would require rwd so? I've driven the LS430 more than once now in all its "modes" and it didn't drive like anything to me. Still mushy and nothing even close to being nimble (compared to what?). Saying it is nible for it's size really isn't saying anything when larger cars in the same segment are more nimble, like the A8 or 7-Series. I'm still waiting to hear what the advantage is of the LS being rwd compared to similarly plush and isolated Avalon or ES330 when none of them have any road feel or any sense of even being on the road. There is hardly any major difference b/w the S and the LS in driving and road isolation. Careful wording here. No there isn't any "major" difference in "road isolation" as you put, but there is a difference in their driving characteristics for sure. None of the German cars in this segment isolate you completely from the road or the sound of the engine like the LS does. Nor do they have the mushy steering either. Have you read the Nov C&D review on a short drive of the 2007 S500 ? Was it glowing ??? I'd say not. With a Maybach exterior, exaggerated rear wheel flares, and the BMW-interior, hmmm ! who knows how it will be received when it arrives here next spring ? Yeah I read it. I have to ask you the same question because the review wasn't negative in the least and it was pretty good for such a short drive: Mercedes is hoping younger buyers will find the S-class's aggressive new shape appealing. To our eyes the fender flares are more sports car than über-Benz, but they do make room for the larger wheels that are mandatory on this type of car. This big Benz dynamically and stylistically straddles the line between the over-the-top-engineered and overweight early-'90s S-class and the svelte and stylish late-'90s version. It has enough advanced engineering and technology to make a robot blush, and it's all wrapped in stylish sheetmetal. Source Sounds like to me they haven't made their final judgement yet and there is much more to come. No need to reach for something that isn't there. M |
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Replying to: merc1 (Nov 15, 2005 10:42 pm) Ford is definitely in better shape, as I think one of their biggest problems was their dull as dishwater styling on products like the 500 and Freestyle. People seem to like the Fusion quite a bit. Mercury is somewhat of a mess, and Lincoln is an even bigger mess, but I think the Ford core brand will be fine. I'm very curious to see what Volvo is going to come up with in the next few years. Ford seems to want Volvo to compete with brands like BMW and Mercedes, and to push Jag up into the Bentley stratosphere. I'm not sure the plan for Jag is such a hot idea, but a bunch of dramatically sportier V8 powered Volvos will definitely be interesting. |
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TOKYO (Reuters) - Toyota Motor Corp. (7203.T: Quote, Profile, Research) will begin using a cheaper and smaller hybrid system from 2008, more than doubling production of the fuel-sipping vehicles by then to 600,000 units a year, the Asahi daily reported on Wednesday.... By making the system smaller, Toyota aims to slash the premium by half and expand its use to most of its mid-sized or larger cars, the Asahi said, without citing sources. link title |
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Replying to: merc1 (Nov 15, 2005 9:52 pm) That I agree. Everytime I read a piece of boring crap trying to play down the best selling luxury brand, chances are it is from that same 1 person.
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Replying to: killerbunny (Nov 16, 2005 10:05 am) Everytime I read a piece of boring crap trying to play down the best selling luxury brand, chances are it is from that same 1 person. Which global luxury brand leader are you referring to BMW or MB? In fact there seems to be more than 1 person that plays down these two best of the best luxury marques 
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