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High End Luxury Cars

24723 messages,  Last post on Jan 28, 2013 at 6:55 PM

You are in the Sedans Forum.

What is this discussion about? Audi A8, BMW 7 Series, Jaguar XJ-Series, Lexus LS 460, Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Volkswagen Phaeton, Maserati Quattroporte, Mercedes-Benz CL-Class, Sedan



Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.

A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.

Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.

Messages Page 1083 of 2473

#10815 of 24723 Monday....... by merc1

Oct 24, 2005 (3:00 pm)

Lots of familar (old) themes being tossed around I see.
 
How many Lexus fans here have even driven a 745/750i Sport to even know if the car is tuned for sport? I wonder why most magazines that like softer riding cars like the S-Class, LS, and XJ almost always complain about the 7-Series Sport's ride? The car is set up as a sporty sedan in its segment, more so than any non AMG S, A8 or non "R" XJ. The upcoming S8 will soon join the upcoming S63 as the sporty (if not outright sports sedans) in this class. Claiming what buyers buy these cars for don't change what they are.
 
Lexus being more prestigious than Mercedes and BMW. Is this supposed to be funny? A company that doesn't even control their own home market ain't got no prestige over Europe's ruling luxury car markers - Mercedes-Benz and BMW. Imagine the laughter if Mercedes and BMW were outsold by Lexus in Europe and Germancarfans were to come here and say that MB/BMW are more prestigious. Lexus didn't even become "Lexus" in their own country of origin until this year, yet they're supposed to have some type of prestige over Mercedes and BMW.
Mercedes and BMW building/selling/marketing their A/B and 1-Series cars has not made a radiator grille of difference in their prestige anywhere in the world where they are sold along side those S600s, SLRs, 760Lis, M5s, M6s, 550is and SL65s. This is nothing more than a made up excuse (reaching) to give Lexus some type of advantage because in reality Mercedes makes buses, garbage trucks, taxicabs, and Unimogs, yet that S600 still gets the top spot (unless their is a Rolls or Bentley around) in front of wherever it is parked.
 
Another myth - Mercedes cheapest car is the $29,975 C230 sedan, the truly under 30K hatchback has been gone for a year, and you aren't going to find many 2006 C230s around with non options clinging to that base price. Funny thing is Lexus sells the nearly identical (in hp/price etc.) IS250 for $605 dollars more (30,580) yet that isn't seen as cheap car? Neither car is going to be found in great numbers at those prices. We all know this. Yet if there is a base IS250 or C230 sitting around, they both have a chance at actually selling for less than the magical and oh so prestigious 30K pricepoint.
 
bdr127,
 
Oh don't worry Lexus understands this hence the little 4-cylinder diesel IS model over there, like all those smaller engined C,3,A4 models.
 
M

#10816 of 24723 Re: S550, not S500 [jrock65] by merc1

Oct 24, 2005 (3:02 pm)

Replying to: jrock65 (Oct 24, 2005 10:56 am)
I wonder why they took it upon themselves to change the name for the U.S. market only? Doesn't make sense for them (MBUSA) to do that imo.
 
M

#10817 of 24723 Re: Monday....... [merc1] by oac

Oct 24, 2005 (3:35 pm)

Replying to: merc1 (Oct 24, 2005 3:00 pm)
I wonder why most magazines that like softer riding cars like the S-Class, LS, and XJ almost always complain about the 7-Series Sport's ride? The car is set up as a sporty sedan in its segment, more so than any non AMG S, A8 or non "R" XJ. The upcoming S8 will soon join the upcoming S63 as the sporty (if not outright sports sedans) in this class. Claiming what buyers buy these cars for don't change what they are.
 
And how many S8 or S63 sales would be made again ????
 
Lexus being more prestigious than Mercedes and BMW. Is this supposed to be funny? A company that doesn't even control their own home market ain't got no prestige over Europe's ruling luxury car markers - Mercedes-Benz and BMW.
 
Let's face it, MBs and BMWs derive a huge chunk of their Euro sales from low end 3 and C-class cars that are mostly used as sherpas.... taxi cabs, I mean.. These cars litter the streets of Europe - vinyl seats, no A/C, manual windows, steel wheel covers, pretty much bare-bones... All of which counts towards MB and BMWs *prestige*, eh ? Oh, but here in NA, they market them exclusively as luxury brands... Good marketing that's all...
 
Yes, MB and BMW are pretigious brands, no doubt, but to make them into these super brands is a myth, especially these days. Notice how the new GS is priced close to the comparable MBs and BMWs. How about the new IS and its MB and BMW competition... practically about same. Does that tell you something ???
 
Lexus didn't even become "Lexus" in their own country of origin until this year, yet they're supposed to have some type of prestige over Mercedes and BMW.
 
The kinda of sentiment MB had back in 1989. Continue the sarcasm...

#10818 of 24723 Re: Anyone....? [garyh1] by dewey

Oct 24, 2005 (6:53 pm)

Replying to: garyh1 (Oct 23, 2005 11:30 pm)
Second, how do you think lease rates are set? Are residual values related to how these cars will hold up 3, 4 or 5 years after initial purchase? You better believe it.
 
And which brand has the #1 residual value? Hint: the first initial is B and they are from Bavaria.
 
Which BMWs maintain the best resale values: Certainly not the most reliable among them which are the family of 3 series cars. It is the BMW 7 and 5 series that have the best residual values ! Yes, the BMW 7 series! Which coincidentally is the whipping boy among you CR obsessesed Lexus fans!

#10819 of 24723 Reliablity Viral Contagion! by dewey

Oct 24, 2005 (7:06 pm)

This Lexus mania with reliability is like some contagious virus! I myself was afflicted with this virus and if you want proof look at my dozen or so posts in this forum. Every single one is about reliability. I call this obsession with reliability insanity!
 
I mean c'mon this is a luxury marque forum dealing with exciting premium priced sport-luxury vehicles! So what do you guys focus on most: Which car has the most refined lavish interior? Nope! Which car is the most driveable and exciting? Nope! Which car has the best fit and finish quality? Nope! Which car has the best aesthetic styling? Nope! Which car is most reliable? Yes, yes, yes and yes again!
 
If this was a Hyundai forum where fans boast about the awesome reliability stats their Korean cars are receiving from CR/JD Power, I would not be surprised at all!
 
But for God's sake this is not a Hyundai forum, remember? This is a LUXURY MARQUE FORUM! Why on earth spend money on a premium priced Lexus when you can get a Hyundai and rave in Hyundai forums about good CR stats!

#10820 of 24723 Re: Reliablity Viral Contagion! [dewey] by ljflx

Oct 24, 2005 (7:08 pm)

Replying to: dewey (Oct 24, 2005 7:06 pm)
You don't do residual values on an absolute dollar basis - you do them on a percentage of original MSRP basis. Using the right basis means the LS430 is easily tops in its class.

#10821 of 24723 Re: Reliablity Viral Contagion! [ljflx] by dewey

Oct 24, 2005 (7:10 pm)

Replying to: ljflx (Oct 24, 2005 7:08 pm)
We are talkig percentages based on the Blue Book! Absolute dollars has no relevance whatsoever!!
 
Call it ESP but I sense a whole slew of future statistical-related posts!
 
I can feel those viral sympthoms again

#10822 of 24723 Re: Reliablity Viral Contagion! [dewey] by oac

Oct 24, 2005 (7:25 pm)

Replying to: dewey (Oct 24, 2005 7:06 pm)
But for God's sake this is not a Hyundai forum, remember? This is a LUXURY MARQUE FORUM! Why on earth spend money on a premium priced Lexus when you can get a Hyundai and rave in Hyundai forums about good CR stats!
 
I am not sure what your line of business is, but if you are in a business that makes your time very very valuable then you'd understand why reliable transportation is paramount. When you spend the kind of money these cars cost, you don't want to be dealer-hoping, trying to get your car serviced or fixed for nicks and knacks... Reliable car means never getting you and your business associates stranded on the road... or not been able to make your important appointment bcos your car wouldn't start... or other myriad of electronic gremlins that can afflict these high-end, electronics-laden cars...
 
Think about this for a minute: the higher the marque, the more electronic gizmos that are crammed into them, and the greater the propensity for them to malfunction. Meaning: You gotta have cars that are RELIABLE, where these electronic features are seamlessly integrated and functions flawlessly *most of the time*. All of which Lexus sedans and trucks do fairly well...
 
That's why Lexus is the #1 selling luxury brand in NA.
That's why the LS430 is the #1 selling premium full-size luxury sedan in NA.
 
Reliable, luxury, build quality, customer service, value priced, and good retention of value....Lexus is #1 in almost all of these categories...

#10823 of 24723 Re: Reliablity Viral Contagion! [oac] by dewey

Oct 24, 2005 (7:42 pm)

Replying to: oac (Oct 24, 2005 7:25 pm)
Let me list some of the best and most expensive premium priced sport or luxury vehicles on earth:
 
Ferrari
Bentley
Mercedes Benz/Maybach
Rolls Royce
Lambroughini
 
Are any of the above vehicles renowned for RELIABILTY?? I dont think so!
In fact we all know that they are renowned for their UNRELIABILITY!
 
So why do people spend humungous sums on such cars as listed above? Maybe such purchasers dont read CR and prefer reading Conde Nast and the Wall Street Journal?
 
In other words reliabiltiy is a main concern for the proliteriat masses and a trifling concern for a select few capitalists who can afford the cars they dream about!

#10824 of 24723 Re: Reliablity Viral Contagion! [dewey] by ljflx

Oct 24, 2005 (7:48 pm)

Replying to: dewey (Oct 24, 2005 7:10 pm)
Well - I don't know how you do things or measure financial numbers but in my world if something cost 100K to start and sells for 60K today that works out to a lower residual than somerthing that started at $80K and holds in at $55K now. If you want to look at absolute retention instead of percent of original price retained then you should also look at the inverse - that being absolute dollars lost to depreciation. There's a quid-pro-quo for everything. I'm really not into disputing this so as far as I'm concerned it can end right now with you buying into absolutes and me buying into percentages. But I must say I hope you don't view stock prices like this.

Messages Page 1083 of 2473

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