Last post on Jan 28, 2013 at 6:55 PM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Audi A8, BMW 7 Series, Jaguar XJ-Series, Lexus LS 460, Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Volkswagen Phaeton, Maserati Quattroporte, Mercedes-Benz CL-Class, Sedan
Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.
A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.
Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.
#10449 of 24723 Re: BMW joins DCX/GM on hybrids [syswei]
Sep 09, 2005 (9:21 am)
"I agree, over time Lexus will be able to raise its prices relative to the Germans."
As far as I am concerned it happened a long time ago with 2001 being the real benchmark year of major change. That is when Lexus kept raising the ante while MB lowered its prices significantly. A fully loaded LS Ultra is a stone's throw away from an MB S430 and the lease cost is equal or higher (sometimes noticably higher) because MB subsidizes its leases. Across the board Lexus has been ramping up its revenue by adding more and more equipment and selling less and less base cars. Base prices have hardly changed in 8-10 years but the cars being sold have moved up on average of $8-10K, and in some cases $14-15K in the case of the ultra. Most new models have been in the high end segment, GX, LX. and SC over that period as well. On average Lexus sales per unit are much higher than 6-10 years ago despite those nearly static base car prices.
#10450 of 24723 Re: diesel is no panacea [bdr127]
Sep 09, 2005 (9:31 am)
"Look at all the celebrities buying hybrids because it's "trendy"...."
Need we look any further as to why MB and BMW don't want to miss out on this the way they missed the SUV curve??
#10451 of 24723 Re: BMW joins DCX/GM on hybrids [lexusguy]
Sep 09, 2005 (2:04 pm)
I guess I just would like to order what I wanted even if it was then fully equipped...In my case I was thinking of getting a more stripped down version for my daughter as her lexus suv is getting on in age now...IMO the lexus use to really be a value, but as it has caught on over the years their prices have closed the gap in a big way...Still a value but not near as much...Their new LS will probably be even pricier and then no matter how you look at it sixty five-- seventy five thousand is a large number....Tony
#10452 of 24723 Re: Why do I get the feeling [pat]
Sep 09, 2005 (2:20 pm)
I read the `european touring sedans` from your previous sugestion and found the trips to be a good comparison, although the details were a bit on the short side.imo....I had the really old Jag xj6 and in it`s day the feel and steering were marvelous, although the a/c did not do it`s job here in the south....My friend also had one and it cought on fire from the catalitic converter catching the grass on fire...Burned up...Those were many years ago......I do think it better to have some people that have different opinions, on any subject, and lively interest versus nothing at all which I have observed on numerous high end cars.... When it gets tedious you have usually stopped it .Tony
#10453 of 24723 Re: BMW joins DCX/GM on hybrids [kdshapiro]
Sep 11, 2005 (7:59 am)
I own a hybrid...It is fully loaded with a very good sound system...GPS...Power everything...smart key type entry...Through the dash 6 CD changer...Plenty of Power...It gets an honest 52 MPG....in mixed driving...ALSO HAS ESC..ABS...and 6 airbags...It is much Bigger in the interior then it looks from the outside....Leather...Hi-indensity Headlights...There is nothing to plug in for the batteries...I do not need to go to special gas stations...It uses regular ...It passes emissions standards in every state in the union. The rear seats fold down flat to offer a huge space for whatever....Full sized people can actually sit in the back seat.
I paid $28,000 for the car...I could have gotten it through Costco for $25,000...(didn't find that out till later) The Base Model through Costco would have Cost $19 to $20,000...That was BEFORE the Auto industry went crazy with Discounts. (bought last March)
What does a Diesel Cost?....Is there an inconvience factor because you need to go to a special gas stations?....Does it pass emissions standards in every state in the union...
Hybrid Cars..are not all that expensive...Mine is an 05 Preis...
#10454 of 24723 Re: BMW joins DCX/GM on hybrids [michael_mattox]
Sep 11, 2005 (8:40 am)
"Is there an inconvience factor because you need to go to a special gas stations?"
Every gas station in my area has diesel for below regular gas.
"Mine is an 05 Preis"
blueguy posted his impression of a Prius, it seems to be way different than yours.
#10455 of 24723 Again...
Sep 11, 2005 (9:13 am)
The diesel and hybrid discussion is better placed on the News & Views board and/or the Hybrids board.
We need to get back to the broader subject of the High End marques. And it would be reaaally nice if we could talk about some of the really high end marques instead of just the two maufacturers we get so stuck on in here ...
#10456 of 24723 Really high end cars
Sep 11, 2005 (2:33 pm)
I also really would like to read what those that had experience with really high end cars would have to say.....I am unfortunately afraid that there are so few of them that we won`t read much......I am in the process of possibly getting an Audi 8 that I will report on when I have something to contribute, but it is not that `high end`, although for me it is very high end... Just think the Lexus , BMW, Jaguar, and Mercedes really represent the vast majority of the luxury cars that individuals purchase. I would think that the people are pretty smart in that regard as the dealer network has to be in place for when things go wrong.....I am a bit concerned going the Audi route as the dealerships have been far and few between....I did think of Bentley but it would just be `brutal` when small pebbles , or blowing sand after a snow storm, marred such a beautiful car...Also the cost of fixing anything would be exorbitant... Many month ago on the Lexus discussion I related how our driving habits have changed so much that the really luxurious cars are not really adaptible to this modern world..It would be too expensive to drive a two hundred thousand dollar car on a long road trip, therefore on the road you rarely see one other than near the ``Large Expensive Cities` .Never the less I still thought about it....Tony
#10457 of 24723 Re: Really high end cars [anthonyp]
Sep 11, 2005 (6:23 pm)
Interesting post. What is the number or reference to your earlier post on US driving habits on the Lexus board. I'd like to read it.
One reason why you don't see many very high end cars on the road is that these are the couple's third or fourth car and they get driven only on weekends while at their country place. They just aren't taken on long road trips for a variety of reasons although I don't think cost is one. This summer I did though see a Maybach with NY plates parked in front of the Ritz in Montreal while the owners checked in. The four digit, low mileage on three and four year old very high end cars amazes me.
I have a theory about the ownership of very high end cars that I'd like to try out. By the time someone can realistically shop for a very high end car (i.e., above 200K), that purchase is probably competing with a light twin plane, a sport fishing boat, or even the second vacation home. IMHO people with the means to buy an above 200K car are not the motorheads like us or that they perhaps once were. They have moved on to bigger and better toys. (The reason for the 200K cutoff is that it strikes me that a moderately successful working couple--maybe a JD/MD, DDS/CPA, anyone really who files a joint return north of 180K-- could scrape up the money to get into a Bentley Continental or a MB S and use it as a daily driver.)
#10458 of 24723 Re: Really high end cars [blckislandguy]
Sep 11, 2005 (7:24 pm)
Block Island guy - I know several people worth $100mln+ and none have a high end car beyond the class we talk about here. The reason - in at least two of the people I know in that class is that it is a total waste and one more thing to take care of - in their opinion. As well a real high end car will depreciate rapidly whether driven or not. These people are much more into second and tirtiary lux homes and the travel to get them there - one has a gorgeous second home in Nantucket and a third in the Turk and Caicos for example. Thus the interest is greater in flying planes or more accurately into buying flight time on private jets - usually the highest class possible. The reason of course is the luxury of flying to and from their vacation homes and other vacations around the world as well as the luxury of flying on business without all the nuanaces of security checks on commercial flights. They also much rather buy an expensive yacht than a Rolls. You could argue that they can do all of this but they also have estate planning as well as wanting to maintain a large stockpile of cash for business opportunities. My opinion - the people that buy very expensive high end cars are the people that inherit money much more so than the people that earn the money.