Last post on Jan 28, 2013 at 5:55 PM
You are in the Sedans
What is this discussion about?
Audi A8, BMW 7 Series, Jaguar XJ-Series, Lexus LS 460, Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Volkswagen Phaeton, Maserati Quattroporte, Mercedes-Benz CL-Class, Sedan
Let's try to define this forum as being limited to luxury performance vehicles where the mainstream version in a typical configuration has an MSRP of at least $60k.
A luxury vehicle with a base price of $59k qualifies because it would typically be bought with some additional equipment, bringing the MSRP over $60k.
Vehicles like the E, 5, A6, M, or GS, even if available in certain versions over $60k, don't qualify because they are cars from companies that have higher end cars in their lineups.
#10268 of 24726 Re: merc1 [ljflx]
Aug 14, 2005 (10:11 pm)
It's like unneeded bad advertising. On the opposite end of the spectrum I never believed Audi had a real acceleration problem in the 80's yet all those news reports took their toll heavily.
Yeah that was really something, and it was based on a problem a lot of Americans still have, not knowing how to drive. Right after that everything from Camrys to 300Es were claimed to have the same problem, yet not one car from any brand was found to have a default. Such nonsense nearly killed Audi in this country. They sold a little of 12K in 1992-1993 I think, but they hung in there. Now I think their problem is exposure, and of course bad rep in the reliability surveys. We were having a discussion about Audi's dealerships on another board. They never seem to have one in the same areas with MB/BMW/Cadillac/Lexus you know the usual "dealers row" area of your average metro area. I think Audi has an exposure problem that is just as big as their reliabilty problem. I actually think Audi could sell more cars if they had more dealers in strategic places, or at least in more places where other luxury cars brands are represented.
#10269 of 24726 Re: sos [stroudman]
Aug 14, 2005 (10:34 pm)
I have had to acquire a taste for the new S, but I can say I have gone from thinking it was o.k. to liking it pretty well. I've seen better photos more recently, and I guess seeing it in the flesh will determine my real opinion. Late jan early feb is what I'm hearing for availablity, plus the saks 5th ave., or whatever limited edition cars they're making only 40 or so of, that will be sold in october, if I remember correctly. The 450 is either mid model intro for '07, or maybe '08. I'm excited about the car, and we're starting to take orders for them, which is good to see. I'm not too proud to admit that I'm a little nervous about all the new tech going into this car...I hope it's not a repeat of the 220.
Well I like everything except that rear fender arch, so I too will have to see the car in person before making final judgement. In some pics it isn't as bad as in others. Of course darker colors hide it, but a Mercedes has to look good in silver so that is no good if they have to be in darker colors all the time. The interior appear to show a level of quality and detailing not seen in any Benz since the previous SL or W140 S-Class (at the beginning of its production, not the latter years). Yes it appears that the S500 will be a 90K car to start with 100K easily attainable, with the 335hp S450 being closer to 79-81K.
#10270 of 24726 Re: sos [merc1]
Aug 15, 2005 (3:06 am)
Yes it appears that the S500 will be a 90K car to start with 100K easily attainable, with the 335hp S450 being closer to 79-81K.
OK, I'm too lazy to go look on other boards...what are the major innovations that the new S is going to introduce (not counting the fenders )? Stroudman talked about the car being loaded with high tech.
#10271 of 24726 Re: Merc1 [merc1]
Aug 15, 2005 (5:53 am)
For the money one pays for MB, even one, ie. me, gets stranded by the side of the road is unacceptable. And let me tell you, the dealer didn't treat me nice either. That's why Bussinessweek says MB is now a "quality has-been". Please read the article "Dark Days at Daimler" in BW before you post again. We all want MB to get back to "one of teh world's most-admired premium rands" again.
#10272 of 24726 Re: MB in the press [merc1]
Aug 15, 2005 (6:38 am)
Survey after survey says MB's status is nowhere what it USED to be and you are the only one that stills says it's the same. Is this the power of ONE?
#10273 of 24726 Re: Lexux? [merc1] Wrong Framing [greenbelt] [merc1]
Aug 15, 2005 (7:20 am)
Have you just acknowledged that Lexus outsells Mercedes in the Luxury Sedan LS vrs S....and SUV markets....but Mercedes outsell lexus in TAXI's so they are the better company?
This is the high end Luxury Marque board...Shouldn't the Mercedes Taxis and Mercedes As and Bs and Cs...be compared to ...Fords and Chevies and Kias?
#10274 of 24726 Re: MB in the press [ctsang]
Aug 15, 2005 (7:22 am)
Disagree. I for one still believe MB is number one in status but it slipped badly and they now have challengers that are getting so close to it in stature that it may not mean much anymore. As far as I am concerned MB pushed the status advertising the past few years because it needed to re-enforce something that had slipped so much in people's perceptions. I doubt it worked and it was probably a big waste of ad money. You never saw ads pushing status so hard in the past because MB quality spoke for itself and its customers certified it by selling used cars for such super high residuals. That was true status, but those days are over.
#10275 of 24726 a history question
Aug 15, 2005 (7:28 am)
I read somewhere that back in the 60s, high-hp, high-displacement engines were fairly common, but then the high gas prices brought about by the embargo in the early 70s put an end to "gotta have a big engine".
Is all that generally true?
Do people think that if gas prices continue to head higher, big-engines will fade a bit? I still remember that BMW used to sell a 735 in the US (I know that they also once had a 728, but don't know if it was sold here), but now the smallest they sell here is a 4.8 liter 750i.
Maybe in a few years we'll look like Europe...lots of small-engined versions being sold.
Maybe high gas prices will cause some of the performance-lovers to change what they drive, and the way they drive.
#10276 of 24726 Re: MB in the press [ljflx]
Aug 15, 2005 (7:55 am)
Disagree. What was the last time you see Rolex ads by the company, not by watch dealers? For my household who own one or more Rolexes each, MB is NO LONGER number one in status. Rolls Royce is still number ONE.
#10277 of 24726 Re: a history question [syswei]
Aug 15, 2005 (9:21 am)
I had a 350HP 74 Monte Carlo and a 430 or 450 was available. A buddy of mine had either a 430 or 450 grand prix. But it didn't have the 0-60 power or the torque that lower powered V-8's have now. I got 15-17 mpg on the highway. Those engines were set to get best gas mileage at 55-60mph. In those days A/C was a drain on gas , costing you 3-4 miles per gallon. Sometimes I see some real oldtimers still driving around with windows open on highways in hot weather. I'm convinced they still think A/C performs like it did 30 years ago. So now that A/C is efficient they are killing their mileage by increasing drag.