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High Performance Luxury Sedans

1038 messages,  Last post on Jun 18, 2008 at 12:12 PM

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What is this discussion about? Jaguar XJR, Mercedes-Benz E-Class, BMW M5, Mercedes-Benz E55 AMG, Audi S6, Maserati Quattroporte, Audi S8, Sedan

#865 of 1038 M5 or STS V by mbukukanyau Jul 13, 2004 (3:21 pm)
We will soon decide, by June 05, we will know       Hopefully Cadillac has learnt from CTS V wheel hop
#866 of 1038 by merc1 Jul 13, 2004 (11:41 pm)
What are the project hp numbers for the STS and XLR V models? I'm reading 420hp, that won't cut it with the E55, M5 and next RS6.   M Replies to this message: mbukukanyau (Jul 14, 2004 7:26 am)
#867 of 1038 Re: [merc1] by mbukukanyau Jul 14, 2004 (7:26 am)
Replying to: merc1 (Jul 13, 2004 11:41 pm) 0-60 # do count though, If cadillac can use good ratios to cut the gap in 0-60, with 420 horses, they are in the game, if they tweak the right things, but Yes, with V10 500 HP monsters, they are perhaps outgunned, people do like having healthy stables with lots of horses.   If they made the Northstar a 6.0 up from the 4.6 it is now for V applications, or drop in the V12 they are building for the escalade V, they might have a chance. Alternatively, they can chop off two cylinders from the V12 to a V10, but with their current CTS,SRX,STS Sigma platform, I doubt there is enough space in the Engine bay for a V10.   So for now, the M5 rules the Horses party
#868 of 1038 by merc1 Jul 14, 2004 (8:36 pm)
We'll see because I doubt any of that will happen. This new M5 is going to inhale this segment I predict. The only problems will be idrive and styling, for some folk.   M
#869 of 1038 merc1 - another problem ... by habitat1 Jul 15, 2004 (2:07 am)
...an SMG only transmission. This is one prospective buyer an 12-24 months who may be left on the sidelines if they don't offer a 6-speed manual as an alternative. For BMW to put all their engineering effort into developing a 8,250 rpm lightweight V10 and then mate it only to an SMG without offering a true manual transmission is more offensive to me that both i-Drive and Bangled styling combined. As a matter of fact, the exterior styling is growing on me.   If I wanted a fast shifting automatic to maximize drag racing performance, I can get a current AMG E55 with 516 ft lbs to go along with close to 500 horsepower. I seriously doubt the M5 will better the E55 in 0-60, 0-100, 0-150, 1/4 mile or any other measure any idiot with a heavy right foot (and $80,000) can achieve. However, if I want to "drive" the "ultimiate DRIVING machine", then for god's sake, let me do it, BMW! The M5 only has nominal more torque than a 545i 6-speed (another 15% +/-, I believe for around 370 ft lbs). If ever a sport sedan called for a 6-speed, it's one that has high horsepower, low torque and an 8,250 rpm redline. And that's been BMW's Motorsports past forte in the face of AMG's alternative to increase torque to supersonic levels.   For me, the new M5 could have been a spectacularly fun car to drive with a true 6-speed. Now I might need to buy another Honda S2000, as long as they don't do something stupid like swap it's 6-speed for a thumb controlled SMG.   Stupid move BMW. There are still some of us that have a left foot and want to "drive" your cars, you know. The previous M5 did just fine with ONLY offering a true 6-speed, as evidenced by considerably higher resale value than the automatic only E55. You are snatching defeat out of the jaws of victory with respect to this prospective buyer. Replies to this message: mbukukanyau (Jul 15, 2004 9:49 am) bhill2 (Jul 15, 2004 11:29 am)
#870 of 1038 Interesting observation indeed by w210 Jul 15, 2004 (2:17 am)
As some may find the 545i/6 more fun to drive than the M5!
#871 of 1038 habitat1 by merc1 Jul 15, 2004 (2:22 am)
Reading that - I'm speechless. I see your point completely. Have they officially said there will be no true manual this time around? I would think they'd make the SMG an option, but it doesn't look that way huh?   W210,   Do you still have your E55? If so how has the experience been?   M
#872 of 1038 Re: merc1 - another problem ... [habitat1] by mbukukanyau Jul 15, 2004 (9:49 am)
Replying to: habitat1 (Jul 15, 2004 2:07 am) Perhaps Cadillac should step in and offer U a manual on the STS V Mr. Merc1. that would keep your left foot busy
#873 of 1038 Re: merc1 - another problem ... [habitat1] by bhill2 Jul 15, 2004 (11:29 am)
Replying to: habitat1 (Jul 15, 2004 2:07 am) I am also not sure I am ready to take my left foot out of the driving experience, but I am keeping my mind open. Despite taking that foot out of action, the SMG is not an automatic. Mainly, it doesn't have a torque converter to muffle your right foot's ability to control the car's balance. In fact, the only difference your right foot should be aware of is that it doesn't have to lift in order to shift. Thus, the SMG should give all of the control of a full manual.
#874 of 1038 mbukukanyau by merc1 Jul 18, 2004 (8:21 pm)
Well you have to remember I'm a Mercedes fan so a manual isn't a big deal to me, but I surely understand those who feel they must have one.   I doubt if Cadillac, Mercedes, Audi or Jaguar will ever offer a true manual in their mid-level performance cars like the STS-V, E55, RS6 or S-Type R. I just don't see it, and they probably wouldn't sell here anyway. BMW on the other hand wears performance like a badge and their customers have been groomed to accept and now crave manuals.   bhill2,   Well most of that is true, but you still don't have the lever and the computer still decides and executes the "shift" for the most part.   M

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