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Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Volkswagen Passat Prices Paid and Buying Experience
3318 messages, Last post on Nov 12, 2009 at 9:57 AM
You are in the Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum. Your Hosts are car_man & kyfdx
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its_kristy--in the words of Donnie Brasco, "Ain't the Question..." The dealers who hang out here have protested over and over again that they *never* solicit business and that they have *no intention* of personally benefiting from their participation here. Even if they do not instigate a plug, however, I think your post (and other posts that mention salesmen and contact info) indicates that they do in fact benefit quite directly. As I understand it, this is meant to be a non-commercial forum; in my opinion, your post was a free commercial, and something that would be more appropriately displayed at a VW website. There is no question that some of the dealers here are helpful. For instance, I was surprised and pleased by brentwoodvolvo's post #624. On the other hand, I think that many of the questions fielded by dealers, could just as easily be answered in a non-biased manner by any number of your fellow net-savvy consumers who have easy access to reliable sources. After all, first and foremost this is a consumer forum. As many of the dealers have demonstrated, they are also here to shape public opinion--literally "pre-negotiating" for their fellow dealers. All you have to do is read the "2001.5 Pricing" forum, or track this discussion back a few months to see their biased "inside information" in predicting MSRP (or higher) pricing for the newest Passat. |
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More definitively, our ban on solicitation prevents anyone from plugging for personal gain. A consumer gets no gain from saying "Hey, I just got a great deal at XYZ Motors - go see Joe, he really treated me well." On the other hand, a salesperson is indeed attempting personal gain by asking another Town Hall member to contact him to see if he has the vehicle in stock. Similarly, if someone has created a webpage for the purpose of selling a product or generating revenue through hit counts, that too is considered solicitation and is not permitted. Hope that clears it up. kcram Host Smart Shopper and FWI Message Boards |
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| I was merely drawing attention to the fact that the dealers who frequent these forums have carved out quite a niche for themselves--and regardless of the actual mechanism, they are benefiting, both directly and indirectly, through their presence here. They receive a direct benefit if a customer comes to them "through" this website, and they receive an indirect benefit if they are able to discourage promising negotiating strategies in these forums. These dealers are not idiots; they know what they are doing here. Call me paranoid, but...(sigh)...well, go ahead, call me paranoid... | |
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Snurple, we all know where you stand on this issue, oh, how we know. Although I don't think you are paranoid, I do think you have a predetermined opinion of all dealers and are both unwilling and unable to deviate from it, even if it does not apply. If you think that my post was a 'free commercial', then that could be said about every single post on this site that praises the attributes of the passat. They benefit VW and ALL VW dealers because like I said, you can't buy a VW at the grocery store. Consumers WILL buy the passat, from the dealer I plug or a different one. I just don't see the big deal with dealers posting information on this site, ulterior motive or not. People on this site are not stupid. I know exactly why dealers are on this site but as long as they provide information and aren't posting spam, then I have no problem with it. I personally could care less where the information comes from, as long as I get it without a blatant sales pitch. Can the posts from the dealers be biased? Of course, but so can the posts from consumers. I think people on this site know how to filter posts, from dealers and consumers alike. |
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Hi, I live in St. Louis and am looking to buy a 1.8T automatic Passat in the near future. I have used the online pricing services like Autobytel, StoneAge, AutoAdvantage, and carsdirect. All these websites have eventually put me in touch with dealers who basically quoted me MSRP (or more) for the 2001.5 Passat. My questions are: 1. Has anyone ever gotten a good offer on a car website? 2. Because of these high prices, I am also looking at the "old" 2001 Passat (which I assume I might be able to get a much better deal on than MSRP), do people have an idea of what is a good price for the old 2001 Passat? 3. I read on the Edmunds website that VW dealers have a 1500 dollar factory to dealer incentive on old 2001 Passats that ends the first week of March. Does this mean that the incentive ends or could it increase even more to say $2000? 4. I am also tempted to look at dealer courtesy cars when I go to the dealerships, but got negative feedback about them on this website. One thing I have read is that dealer cars may be a bad idea because any mileage on the car will count toward the 2/24,000 warranty. When I have a car, I don't think I'll put more than 10,000 miles on it for the first two years due to my school situation (people in my class are averaging 5,000mi/year). Is mileage the only thing that detracts from the dealer courtesy car? Or have people found that dealers do not treat these cars very well since they know they will get rid of them in the near future? 5. I read on a website that a fair way to calculate the price of a car is to take the invoice price, subtract any factory to dealer incentives and "hold back" then pay 5% over that. Is that too much or too little to offer for the old 2001 Passat? How would I adjust this formula for a dealer courtesy car? thanks |
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I recently had a terrible experience with Trans Ocean VW in Pasadena, CA. I used MSN Carpoint and was contacted by the "internet manager" at Trans Ocean. I am looking for a very specific color combination of Passat GLX. He told me that they had the exact car I was looking for, and quoted me a price that, while a little high, I was willing to live with in order to get the car. I spoke with him at least 6 times during the day, and indicated that I would be in that night to buy the car. I left work early and raced through traffic to get to the dealership before the salesman left, only to have him tell me when I got there that he "made a mistake" and that he didn't actually have the car I wanted. I had asked him various questions about the car, and he "checked on the car" to answer my questions, so clearly he should have known that what he was looking at was not the car I wanted. He then proceeded to try to sell me various other cars sitting on his lot. He finally realized that I already knew what I wanted, and then he offered to run a search for the car. I think he knew that I was incredibly mad for being misled, because within 15 seconds he claimed that his computer was down, and he wouldn't be able to help me. I looked today on the Better Business Bureau website and discovered that Trans Ocean VW is rated by the BBB as having an unsatisfactory business record. Please do not support Trans Ocean VW's deceptive business practices!!!!! |
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| I think your target of $23,600 for the GLS (1.8T) is unrealistic. I think that is under invoice. Most posts I have seen have been in the 2-4% over invoice range. | |
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| Hi. 10 days ago I picked up my new 2001.5 passat. I love it! Anyway, I came very close to closing with a dealer here in NYC for $22,700 for the 4 cyl. "plain jane" model. Only option added was the auto. transmission. This was the best price I could get in NYC as I checked with 3 diff. dealers. Finally, on a whim, I went to autobytel and they hooked me up with a dealership in Long Island. I emailed them saying I wanted the 4 cycl. no options, just auto. trans. and didn't want to pay more than $22,200. Within minutes the guy emailed me saying I could get it for $22,130. I was thrilled. I saved myself $600 right away. The $22130 included destination charge and auto. transmission. Got it in mojave beige. It wasn't my first choice (I wanted silverstone gray or blue) but now that I have it I wouldn't change it. I love the way the color changes differently in the sunlight. Sometimes It's champagne color, other times it's gold. Very elegant. I also love the black interior. It's not "black" but more charcoal gray. I've seen the other color variations with the mojave beige and this is the best. The beige interior with the beige ext. is in my humble opinion just awful. Way too much beige for me. Anyway, I thought my price was excellent (3% above invoice if I calculated correctly). I've been having a ball with the car. Yesterday on a long road trip, every VW that passed us turned and looked and pointed. I think we are one of the lucky few to have a 2001.5 out on the road. I haven't seen any others yet. good luck. | |
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This practice is quite widespread, and is an essential for the more dishonest dealers "low-ball" pricing. I can tell you that I had a customer the other day in the exact same situation who was about to rip my head off when I told him the car was just sold. Only the car coming up from clean-up with the sold sign in it let the customer know I wasn't like your dealer. In the future, one way to avoid it is to get a VIN on the car and maybe even put a deposit down over the phone. Hope you have better luck with the next guy. Jason |
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