Last post on Oct 14, 2006 at 9:08 AM
You are in the Chrysler PT Cruiser
What is this discussion about?
Chrysler PT Cruiser, Wagon
Aug 05, 2002 (5:09 am)
Couldn't agree with you more. I won't be going to the "gouging" dealer for any purchase ever again. What really got to me was the fact that they had pulled all the official MSRP stickers off the windows of the Turbo Cruisers. They had a "duplicate" sticker that looked like the regular Chrysler MSRP sticker (complete with the Chrysler logo, EPA info, standard/optional equip, warranty info, etc). Usually, when the dealers try to charge more than MSRP, they list things like "ADM" or have some type of pinstriping, wax protection, undercoating line items that they list so it seems you're getting something for the gouge. Not this brazen dealership...just an "official looking" sticker with the additional markup being passed off as the regular MSRP sticker. Only after doing a bit of research on the internet and "trolling" other dealers, did I realize "sleazy" dealer had stickers that were exactly $3,000 above the real Chrysler MSRP. I thought it was illeagl to remove the Chrysler MSRP sticker from the car?
The real MSRP on the ones I saw included probably every option available...leather, sunroof, autostick, etc. The only thing missing were the optional "flames, woody treatment, etc.". They all should be priced at $24,900 on the MSRP, not the $27,900 sticker that the sleazy dealer showed me.
I'll probably wait for a few months and see if Chrysler is going to do rebates on these like they are on the 2002 versions. I'll wait until this time next year, if need be. Won't know until invoice pricing is out, but I suspect that if there's $1,300 play between invoice and MSRP on the '02 Limited's, then it shouldn't be too far a stretch thinking there's $1,500 difference between MSRP and invoice on an '03 PT Turbo.
#398 of 879 graphicguy
Aug 05, 2002 (5:20 am)
I had a similar experience when I went to take my first look at the Matrix. I was looking at a midline XR, and they only had automatics on the lot, so I was thinking something in the $17 K range for the MSRP. Well, the dealership had stripped off the MSRP sticker and replaced it with their own which read $22,500. Another Toyota dealership I visited had a $2000 ADM on every car, $3000 on every truck. And a third Toyota dealership had a $700 "paint treatment" on every vehicle. For a Matrix vehicle that is no better than its competition, Toyota's sales practices might have urged me to consider other vehicles.
#399 of 879 I too was looking at
Aug 05, 2002 (6:31 am)
PT's over the weekend. Although only one Dealer and while closed. The body color bumpers is a vast improvement. No Turbos at this Dealer. They had two '02 "Dream Machines" in Inca Gold. Very sharp but pricey....just over $24k. Although they did have them marked $3k off.
Here in Austin I've seen many Dealers with "Market Adjustment" adds. But never a sticker swap. That is SLEAZY!
Aug 05, 2002 (10:39 am)
While I've been comparing similar vehicles, I noticed that the Matrix, in general, was cheaper on the MSRP than the similar Vibe. Difference being, the "ADM" Toyota dealers put on the stickers to put the MSRP prices right in line with the MSRP of the Vibe. I've seen Honda do the same thing. I wonder what they are going to do with pricing of the '03 Accord since it is new? Will they continue their insistance of MSRP (or above) like they are charging for the Pilot, Ody, CR-V, and Acura's MDX, TL and CL? Toyotas are usually priced higher than Hondas, but with a bit of negotiation, you can usually buy a Toyota for a cheaper price than a similar Honda.
U.S. brands have always been negotiable (except for low production specialty cars like the new Thunderbird).
txyank...the '03 Cruisers look better than previous editions IMHO. If the Turbo Cruiser didn't drive so well, and I wasn't so impressed with it, I'd probably not look at them again after the dealer's shenanigans. They are very good cars, however and I'm willing to wait until I get the deal I want.
#401 of 879 graphicguy
Aug 05, 2002 (11:19 am)
It seems like we're on the same range of cars. Have you looked into the Protege5 by any chance? It's not a tall wagon, like the PT and Matrix which offer a SUV seating feel, and it's not quite so cargo-friendly as those options. It does offer a quality driving experience, however, as suggested in Car and Driver's comparison, as well as strong reliability as evidenced in Consumer Reports. Unlike even the Matrix, the P5 is still made in Japan by Japanese workers using Japanese parts, so quality is sure to be high. And stickering around $17-18 K, it is probably the most affordable of the bunch. Throw in the fact that they're currently offering 0% financing for up to 48 months and no payments until 1/03, and the P5 strikes me as a strong contender in this field. I think at this point that I prefer it to the Matrix.
Aug 05, 2002 (1:11 pm)
I too am interested in the PT Cruiser Turbo but I believe its far too early to make a purchase with it being fresh to the market.
I think i'll wait til the 2004 comes out; by that time the excitement will have died down a bit.
Perhaps then i can pull off another great invoice deal.
Aug 05, 2002 (1:28 pm)
I also looked at the P-5. While it should sticker lower I have found that most of the dealers in my area are only stocking ones that have a window of 20k or a bit higher. It is also the smallest of the bunch. I did like the look but it had no more room than my sedan with the exception of a slightly bigger opening in the back because of the hatch. It didn't feel as if it had any more room than the Focus hatch and at least not as much as the Focus wagon. If room is not a concern it might be a good choise. It still doesn't catch the looks a PT gets but it does come stock with some boy racer goodies.
Aug 05, 2002 (9:54 pm)
Went shopping again tonight. Went to an area of town where there are about a dozen different dealers selling different makes right next to each other...one of those "Automall" type areas. I looked at and drove the Mazda P5. Have to agree with you about the P5. I liked it better than either the Vibe or the Matrix, dollar for dollar. It gave up a bit in acceleration compared to the Vibe/Matrix with the 180 HP engine, but you really have to stay on the boil with a 5-speed to get anything close to decent acceleration out of any of those. Handling of the P5 is its strong suit. I just thought I would get tired of the high revs after a while. Have to admit, they were all fun to drive for a short period of time, though.
The most fun of them all, however was the Subaru WRX. WOW! That's about the only way to describe it. It's priced $2k-$3k above the rest (about the same as a PT Turbo loaded up, comparing MSRP to MSRP...low 20s). I couldn't get past the "cafe racer" look of it. The paint seemed really thin as were the body panels. They cut some definite corners in the details (no paint on some of the door jambs or under the hood/trunk, seats felt thin, swtiches were notchy feeling). But "bang for the buck" really can't be beat.
Last dealership I stopped at was another Chrysler dealer. It was late...about 8:30 p.m. They had the candy apple red color on the floor with black leather and sunroof. It was stunning looking, to say the least. It had 7 miles on it. Sales guys were obviously ready to go home as they looked beat (it's been super hot for the last couple of weeks in my burg...I can only imagine what it was like "pounding the black asphalt" all day). What ended up being the Sales Manager approached me asking me if I was interested in the Turbo (here we go again...). I said yes but would come back when they (and I) had more time. He said, "you're here now, take it for a drive around the block. If you like it, it's the end of the day, I think we can work a deal if it's fair to both of us". Well, I figured it can't hurt. Pulled it out of the showroom. I drove it for about 20 minutes and still liked it best out of everything I had driven. Came back at 9:15 p.m. Only two people left at the dealership was the Sales Manager (who introduced himself as such when I walked in) and the finance lady.
He said make a reasonable offer and lets go home. I said I had a trade. Showed him my '94 Saturn I use as a 2nd car. He started it up. Drove it around the parking lot and said, "it seems to run good". I had all the service receipts with me and showed them to him. He offered me $300 over the best offer I had since I have been shopping (that was also $300 over KBB value). Offered me $550 over invoice (what I assume was invoice since I had to take the sheet he showed me as fact) on the Turbo Cruiser. Besides, the price looked real close to what I had figured it would be. Sounded fair, so I bought it and it's parked in my garage right now.
Finance lady asked me if I wanted extended warranty. I only had to use one "no" and we were trading titles and signing mileage statements.
Didn't get out of the dealership until 10:30 p.m. Sales Manager actually washed and dried it for me by hand and filled it with a full tank of Premium since the "lot tech" had also left for the day, too. Wonder who gets the commission on that sale?
Aug 06, 2002 (2:49 am)
Congrats on the purchase of your Inferno Red Turbo. My wife feels that Inferno Red is the best color, now she wants to trade hers in for an Inferno Red Woodie.
Now the addiction begins. It starts with the fuzzy dice that seem just so right, hanging from the mirror. Then.....
#406 of 879 When I was selling, the Sales Mgr.
Aug 06, 2002 (3:19 am)
would give a deal he made to the Salesman who needed it the most. BTW.....I would have bought a Cruiser when they first came out if they hadn't jacked up the prices.