Last post on Aug 22, 2012 at 10:55 AM
You are in the Chevrolet Metro/Geo Metro
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Geo Metro, Chevrolet Metro, Hatchback
#1835 of 1864 Re: Metro 1.0 starts cold, but not hot. [alan87]
Sep 26, 2011 (5:56 pm)
Sorry but I do not remember whether or not you changed the fuel filter. If you haven't changed the filter; please do so before anything else. I would also locate the ground point for the fuel pump wiring, take the ground bolt out and scrape it, scrape the body panel at that location, and file the wiring connectors until they are shiny clean. Reassemble and securely tighten the bolt.
In addition; the battery ground cable clamp should have a second, smaller wire going to a bolt in the inner fender. If that wire is in place; remove the fender bolt and clean the body panel and wires as described above. If there is only the main battery cable coming from the negative post; make up a length of 12 gauge stranded wire with ring terminals on the ends; and connect it to the negative cable clamp bolt and to a nearby bolt in the fender (after scraping any paint off the fender at that point).
Furthermore; locate the ground point on the back of the intake manifold, a little to the passenger side of the throttle body, which has several wires attached there. Remove and clean all the connectors and metal surface, and securely tighten the ground bolt.
Let me know whether or not you find any problems in those areas. Thanks!
Then, measure the voltage across the battery terminals with the engine off. Write the figure down. Start the motor and measure the voltage with the engine idling. Write that down. Then, with the engine idling; measure the voltage between the battery wire at the ignition coil and ground. Write that figure down. Please post all three readings here. Thanks.
#1836 of 1864 1996 Geo Metro Oil Consumption
Oct 01, 2011 (6:32 pm)
Hi Fellow Metro Owners,
I bought a 1996 Geo Metro a couple of weeks ago. The body is rough but it runs great, I bought this for the gas mileage plus it looks like a fun car to drive. The headlights did not work but after scouring this forum, I found a bad connection at the fuse box and corrected it. My new problem after driving it to work a few days is the oil consumption. It uses a quart about every 75 miles. It has no visible leaks so it must be burning it. I checked compression and #1 has about 60 psi while #2 & 3 have about 120 psi. A squirt of oil in cylinder makes no difference. Cylinder 1 has a cloud shoots out when the engine is cranked with plugs out. I have concluded a bad valve in #1 cylinder but can't imagine why that would cause my oil problem.
Any advice or hints would be greatly appreciated. I am fairly handy around cars and have done almost every repair to my vehicles but haven't done a valve job in more years than I can remember. I have gotten prices for valves and gaskets from local auto parts store but have to wonder if I am being soaked a little on price. The parts are adding up almost to what I paid for the car.
Thanks for your time and expertise.
#1837 of 1864 Re: 1996 Geo Metro Oil Consumption [geomobile]
Oct 01, 2011 (7:04 pm)
My oh my!!! Another Metro with a junk engine bought because the compression was never checked. WHEN WILL PEOPLE LEARN??? The stock compression on a 3 cylinder Metro is 195 PSI. The MINIMUM allowable factory compression spec on this motor is 165 PSI. If you read through this forum; you'll see post after post with the same sad story. These motors are EXTREMELY vulnerable to abuse; and all too many people are insensitive or uncaring about how to treat these cars right. This probably happens because they are so low priced; and people don't seem to respect things they get for cheap.
The reason that oil does not improve the compression on #1 cylinder is the same reason it is consuming so much oil: There is either a big gouge in the cylinder wall (which is too deep to be sealed when you squirt oil into it) or the oil rings and compression rings are stuck; or else there is a warped head and oil is leaking from an oil passage into that cylinder. You have a major repair job here; and it most likely will have to include the bottom end as well as the head.
Check www.rockauto.com for the best parts prices. www.hiperformer.com has the best prices and quality on premium remanufactured engines (with a 7 year, 100,000 mile warranty). They get about $1,600 for the complete Metro motor.
#1838 of 1864 Re: Metro 1.0 starts cold, but not hot. [zaken1]
Oct 06, 2011 (3:32 pm)
Thanking you again...I shall conduct the tests you mentioned. AJ
#1839 of 1864 Re: TheLorax [TheLorax]
Mar 21, 2012 (9:38 am)
HI this is steve i am great fan of chevrolet their design technology is awesome
#1840 of 1864 Re: Metro 1.0 starts cold, but not hot. [zaken1]
Mar 21, 2012 (9:40 am)
hi this is steve before choosing the sensor please see the specifications
#1841 of 1864 Re: TheLorax [stevemartin]
Mar 21, 2012 (10:59 am)
Please note the date on a message before deciding to reply to it. The message you replied to here was written in November 1998; almost 14 years ago. Please also note that Geo Metros were not built with Chevrolet design technology. They were designed and built by Suzuki in Japan.
#1842 of 1864 Geo-metro '98 5 speed w Carb 1.0
Mar 24, 2012 (12:40 pm)
Replaced OG crank shaft position sensor twice and still having issues re-accelerating after having to decelerate in traffic. Car actually shuts off but since its standard shift, I am able to restart while still moving.
I am thinking main bearing may be loose (which I would rather not spend the $ to replace since the car has over 130,000 miles lol) so I am going to try thicker oil - 20w-50. (now using 5w-30)
Any other ideas?
#1843 of 1864 Re: Geo-metro '98 5 speed w Carb 1.0 [tvmogul]
Mar 24, 2012 (2:59 pm)
Yeah; I have several other tried and tested ideas; but they largely go against your ideas. If you have enough trust to consider them; it will be to your benefit.
1> Your '98 Metro is not a Geo Metro; it is a Chevy Metro. General Motors sold the Suzuki built Metro under the Geo brand from 1989 to 1997; but they changed the name of the car to Chevy Metro in 1998, and it remained a Chevy Metro from 1998 through 2001, when it was last sold. The 1.0 liter motor was last sold in 2000. The importance of this is that if a parts clerk looks under Geo for parts for a 1998 model; they won't find any listings.
2> Like many other owners; you have mistaken the throttle body fuel injection unit on your car for a carb. Metros never had a carb. The fuel injection throttle body just looks like a carb; but if you take it apart; you'll find that there is no choke, no accelerator pump, no float, no jets, no power valve, and there is an electronically driven fuel injector hanging down in the center of the throttle body.
3> If your main bearing really was loose enough to cause the Crankshaft Position Sensor to not function; it would be making enough noise to be heard two blocks away. I assure you that this is NOT a main bearing problem.
4> There have been reports from other '98 Metro owners of problems that seemed to come from a bad crank position sensor. But the real cause turned out to be that this sensor is mounted in the oil pan; and there are aftermarket oil pan gaskets available (probably listed only for Geo Metros; which do not have a crank position sensor) which are significantly thicker than the original part. If the oil pan gasket is replaced with a thicker part; it will move the crank position sensor further from the crank than it was designed to be. And this will cause the sensor to not function at low RPMs.
5> Please have a cylinder compression test run on this motor. The normal compression pressure on this motor is 195 psi. The minimum allowable compression is 165 psi. If the compression on your motor is less than 165; or if there is more than 25 psi difference between any 2 cylinder pressures; the motor will not be able to run properly; and would need to be overhauled or replaced. If your motor passes a compression test; DO NOT change to heavier oil. It will compromise the lubrication at start up; which is the most critical time of all. 10W-30 is the heaviest oil to safely use in this motor.
5> Another issue which will cause this motor to cut out on re-acceleration is spark plugs which have worn to the point where the gap has become too large. The best choice for spark plugs in this motor is Autolite #XP63 or #AP63. The plug gap should be .043". Be very careful if you check the gap on the XP63 plug; the Iridium center electrode is brittle and will break easily if you put any pressure on it.
6> A distributor cap or rotor which has become dirty on the inside or outside will cause the motor to cut out on acceleration. So will a distributor cap in which the carbon button in the center has fallen out or worn away.
7> Spark plug cables which have developed excessive resistance (more than 1,000 ohms per inch of wire length) will also cause this problem.
8> If someone has moved the distributor position; in an ill advised effort to change the timing; it could cause this problem. The ignition timing cannot be adjusted on this motor; but moving the distributor position will change the rotor air gap; which will cause the motor to cut out on acceleration.
#1844 of 1864 Re: Geo-metro '98 5 speed w Carb 1.0 [zaken1]
Mar 24, 2012 (3:42 pm)
First off - let me thank you for your thorough response - it's great to finally get to chat with somebody who clearly knows this vehicle.
Ok so let me give you a few new details and maybe ask a few questions:
The spark plugs are new (with the last month or so-maybe 1000 miles)
Distributor cap has been checked and is perfect (button and contacts are fine)
Oil Pan Gasket is original and has never been off
Except for the time it cuts out (which is on re-acceleration in 5th gear AFTER being forced to slow in traffic) - it runs smooth as glass so would that not eliminate most of those other issues? (ie spark plugs, distributor cap)
It only seems to do it when the engine oil is hot, not the water (which always stays correct), just the oil itself - after the car has been running for a while.
I guess what I am asking is, if those above mentioned options were the issue, wouldn't the car run poorly all of the time and not just in this one, rare instance?