Last post on Aug 22, 2012 at 10:55 AM
You are in the Chevrolet Metro/Geo Metro
What is this discussion about?
Geo Metro, Chevrolet Metro, Hatchback
#1855 of 1864 97 Metro - Lack of Charge
Jun 01, 2012 (2:57 pm)
Pipeman, I feel your reply is mostly correct, however, on most new cars, even when the key is off and all doors are closed and lights are off, there is some current drain due to the continuous feed to the radio or navigation, the clock and various other items which stay in a warmed-up mode all the time. Therefore, you might have a small spark anytime you put the positive or negative cable back on the battery.
#1856 of 1864 98 Chevy Metro Revving High
Jun 02, 2012 (7:48 pm)
I have owned a 98 chevy metro for about 2 months now. all was good, until today when I was driving and I noticed my start ups were way slow and my engine is revving way high. example: I will finally make it to 15 mph (after about 2 mins) I will be in second gear and off the gas pedal my rpms will be about 2000 after lightly pressing on the gas they will jump to 4000ish. I switch it to 3rd gear, still going 15mph, foot off the gas will be 1500rpms foot on the gas about 2800ish rps! any ideas about what is going on? oh and also I can go a mile and only be at 25mph with my highest rpms at 4000. I have never had this problem, please help!
#1857 of 1864 Re: 98 Chevy Metro Revving High [missvikkilynn]
Jun 02, 2012 (9:47 pm)
Your clutch is slipping!!! This happens when the clutch disc wears down from age and use. When the clutch disc wears; it becomes thinner; and the clutch pedal has to be lifted further up before it fully engages. This results in less and less free play at the top of the pedal stroke. There always MUST BE at least 1/2 inch of free play at the top of the pedal. If the free play becomes smaller than 1/2 inch, and the clutch linkage is not readjusted to add more free play; the clutch will not fully engage when the pedal is lifted all the way up. And when that happens; the clutch will begin slipping when you apply power. The higher the gear you are in, and the more engine power you apply; the more severely it will slip. It is not unlike driving with the clutch pedal pressed partly down.
A slipping clutch can sometimes be saved by readjusting the linkage to give the proper free play distance; but if the clutch has slipped too much or for too long; the disc will be permanently damaged. When that happens; the clutch will need to be replaced. This sometimes may only require replacing the disc; but in more severe cases; the pressure plate will have to be replaced, and sometimes the flywheel will have to be resurfaced; and usually the throw-out bearing should be changed.
If you have the free play adjusted and still are not able to recognize what the pedal feels like when the free play is set to the right distance; PLEASE have a mechanic or knowledgable person show you what to look for and how to check it. And don't let them leave until you are totally confident that you understand.
Some drivers never seem to develop the sensitivity or coordination to prevent abusing a clutch (partiularly those people who go around with the radio blasting). It takes integration of the sound of the engine with the coordination of the accelerator pedal and clutch pedal movement to do it gracefully. Metros often do not need any pressure on the accelerator at all; until after the clutch pedal is all the way up; in order to get the car moving; but this, of course, cannot be done if you accelerate from stop lights to keep up with the impatient people who predominate on the roads these days.
I realize that this car probably had the clutch abused by its previous owner(s) and you bought the results of that abuse. But Metros are delicate, sensitive vehicles; and some people destroy the clutches, while others destroy the engines. Most Americans are just too impatient and too insensitive to succeed with this car.
That's a real shame; because I've had my Metro since 1992; and it now has 304,000 miles on the odometer; while it still has the original motor, original clutch, and original rear brake shoes.
#1858 of 1864 96 metro engine into a 92 metro
Jun 07, 2012 (6:49 pm)
I have a 92 metro with a bad engine, and a friend with a 96 engine. What kind of issues will I encounter making this swap?
#1859 of 1864 Re: 96 metro engine into a 92 metro [malibubmx]
Jun 07, 2012 (8:40 pm)
You may not realize that there were at least five different motors used in the 1992 Metro, and at least 3 different motors used in the 1996 Metro.
Basically, the Metro was made with a 3 cylinder, 993cc motor (called the base model and the LSI); or with a 3 cylinder 993cc motor which was designed for more extreme fuel economy (called the XFI, which was not made in 1996); and was also made with a 4 cylinder, 1.3 liter motor. There were also differences in the motor which was used with a manual tranmsission; compared with the motor used with an automatic transmission. And there were difference in motors which were made to meet 49 state emission requirements; compared to motors which were made to meet California emission requirements.
So you first need to make sure that both engines have the same number of cylinders; and use the same type of transmission. You then have to make sure the 1992 vehicle is not an XFI model (XFIs have an all black rear bumper; while base models and LSIs have a two color rear bumper).. But you might be able to get by if both vehicles do not have the same class of emission equipment.
The 1996 vehicles used a totally different electronic engine control system (called OBDII) which would not be practical to adapt to a 1992 vehicle. So you would need to use the 1992 intake manifold, throttle body, distributor, ignition coil, igniter, computer, and wiring harness with the 1996 engine. These parts should be directly interchangeable. There are one or two sensors on the 1996 motor which are not used on the 1992 motor; so they would have to be left disconnected (and preferably removed). Both motors in both years use the same spark plug and the same plug gap.
The 3 and 4 cylinder motors use different model clutches; but the 1992 and 1996 model clutch does not change with the years for each engine type.
The automatic transmission uses the same overhaul kit for both engine sizes and both years (though that does not necessarily mean that the transmissions are entirely the same).
This should be a straighforward swap; providing the engines are the same type, and you folow all the steps listed here.
If you post additional feedback; please list the engine size and transmission type. Also get the emission specification information, from the emission label on the underside of the hood of each car. Thank You.
#1860 of 1864 Re: 96 metro engine into a 92 metro [zaken1]
Jun 08, 2012 (6:24 am)
Thank-you, you have been very helpful. I do know both engines are the typical 993cc version and they both have the 5-spd tranny. I will get the emission info and post it, if you could look at that, I would appreciate it very much.
#1861 of 1864 Re: 96 metro engine into a 92 metro [malibubmx]
Jun 08, 2012 (12:23 pm)
Thank you for the updated details. I would also recommend using the 1992 oil pan; as that eliminates the crankshaft position sensor; which will not be used, and which protrudes from the 1996 pan.
At the bottom of the text on the underhood emission label; there is a note which reads something like "This vehicle conforms to all US emission regulations for 1996 model year new motor vehicles sold in the state of California."
This is where the distinction between California and 49 state emissions can be found.
#1862 of 1864 Re: 96 metro engine into a 92 metro [malibubmx]
Jun 08, 2012 (1:09 pm)
Before you start switching the motor; I would STRONGLY urge you to run a compression test on the 1996 motor. The stock compression on this motor is 195 psi. The minimum allowable limit is 165 psi. There also must not be more than 10% difference between the lowest and highest cylinder pressures.
All too many attractive looking Metro engines have compression that is out of specs. This is the result of driving the car too slowly in 4th or 5th gear under load (due to not downshifting) or mixing brands of oil; either when the oil and filter are changed, or when oil is added betwen changes; or running at high speed, accelerating hard or climbing steep grades before the motor has warmed up to normal operating temperature; or using unsuitable spark plugs or low octane fuel in what is basically a highly tuned motor.
Aug 22, 2012 (9:45 am)
Thank you zaken1 for your help on Venza vs. LexusRX350.
#1864 of 1864 Re: zaken1 Thanks! [raphaelrichman]
Aug 22, 2012 (10:55 am)
You're welcome; but from this unusual location which you chose to contact me; it seems like you may be having difficulty navigating around the Edmunds website (either that; or you are an avid tourist and explorer). I mentinon this because when someone wishes to express appreciation for the help they have received with their "answers" question; the normal way to do that is to log onto the original question (which you can find at http://answers.edmunds.com/question-Are-Toyota-Venza-Lexus-RX-350-vehicles-15983- - 9.aspx) go to the answer you feel was most helpful; and click the "accept as best answer" button. This awards points to the person who wrote that answer. Those points determine our rankings on the site. It is also customary to click the "thumbs up" button under the answer you like; as that awards more points. But I still appreciate your going out of your way to contact me and express appreciation!!!
P.S. I was born in New York (But I have lived in California since 1952).