Ask the Car People.SM


Engine Oil - A slippery subject Part 2

3583 messages,  Last post on Apr 02, 2012 at 3:00 PM

You are in the Maintenance & Repair Forum.

What is this discussion about? Engine, Oil

Messages Page 358 of 359

#3564 of 3583 Re: What "Synthetic Oil" is 100% Synthetic [wings8823] by thecardoc3

Nov 23, 2011 (6:37 am)

Replying to: wings8823 (Nov 22, 2011 9:56 am)
When an oil does meet the O.E. spec it will say so on the back of the bottle.
 
Here is a Castrol Syntec pdf.
 
http://www.bp.com/assets/bp_internet/castrol/castrol_usa/STAGING/local_assets/do- wnloads/p,q/pds_syntec_usa.pdf
 
Here is information on Castrol Edge
 
http://www.bp.com/assets/bp_internet/castrol/castrol_usa/STAGING/local_assets/do- wnloads/f/Castrol_EDGE_FAQ.pdf
 
We can do this with every manufacturer and in fact we really need to today in order to understand what is really required to choose the correct oil for any one car.

#3565 of 3583 Did you see this article here? by thecardoc3

Nov 23, 2011 (6:58 am)

There are a number of articles on this site. Take this one here.
 
http://www.edmunds.com/car-care/oil-life-monitoring-systems.html
 
If you really start studying the topic, and then read that article and watch the videos associated to it you'll notice that they don't even get all of the details straight. Some information is better than none, but when some of it isn't accurate even if it's only by omission that's a problem!

#3566 of 3583 Re: What "Synthetic Oil" is 100% Synthetic [thecardoc3] by wings8823

Nov 23, 2011 (5:58 pm)

Replying to: thecardoc3 (Nov 23, 2011 6:37 am)
Thank you for the feedback. I did more in-depth research three days ago.
 
Lastly, by simply looking on the back of the bottle, I saw that Castrol GTX 5w-20, Castrol Edge w/ Syntec and Castrol Edge with FST (Titanium) ALL meet the "WSS" Ford OEM spec number for the 2011 Ford Taurus SEL.
 
I used the Castrol GTX 5W-20 during my 2011 Ford Taurus's first 4500, plus, miles (changing oil/filter every 1200 miles) to keep clean oil and filter in the egine to preclude possible "beak-in" issues. I am now using the Castrol 5W-20 Edge, FST Titanium Advanced Full Synthetic oil. I will also use the same in my 2003 Lincoln Navigator.
 
As for Mobile 1 5W-20, although a good oil, on the back of this oil bottle and the Mobil 1 Extended Performance bottle it states that Mobil 1 "recommends" use of the oil for meeting Ford's OEM "WSS" spec number for the 2011 Ford Taurus SEL. However, Mobile does not claim that the oil "meets" or "exceeds" the Ford OEM "WSS" spec number.... sort of a "play on words."
 
So.... If an oil company cannot or will not state, CLEARLY, that its oil(s) "meet" or "exeed" a manufactuer's specifications, I will not use the oil. As stated in the web links you sent, oil mixtures are in transition to meet the new standards of OEM manufactuers. Mobile may be waiting to see if their oils will later, in fact, "meet" or "exceed" Ford's "WSS" OEM spec requirements.

#3567 of 3583 Re: Did you see this article here? [thecardoc3] by wings8823

Nov 23, 2011 (10:19 pm)

Replying to: thecardoc3 (Nov 23, 2011 6:58 am)
Thank you for the feedback. My 2011 Taurus SEL owner's manual calls for 5,000 mile oil/filter change if the "oil monitoring system" should ever stop working.
 
I changed the oil and OEM (Motorcraft) filter, refilling with Castrol 5W-20 Edge Titanium FST (gold colored jug)... 5.5 quart capacity w/ filter change (Motorcraft FL-500-S). With 100 miles on the new oil the 'oil monitoring system' shows 99% oil life remaining from about 90% highway driving (62 - 65 MPH). At this mileage rate and current driving conditions, this should register 50% oil life remaining at approximately 7,000 - 7,500 miles. With this in mind, the "pint" size (small) OEM Motorcraft filter may not adequately filter the oil passed the 5,000 mile mark!
 
Ford and other automakers who now have concluded that "Full Synthetic" and/or "Semi-Synthetic" oil is synomous for today's engine libricant they should also redisign their oil filters... mainly increasing the filter volume!!! I am amazed that Ford and many other automakers have not INCREASED the size of their "pint size" small oil filters!
 
For now, I think I will go with a 5 month/5,000 mile oil/filter change using 5W/20 Castrol Edge Titanium FST full synthetic oil. Should I find a larger oil filter, different from the Motorcraft OEM brand, that will not compromise my "new car warranty" then I will consider 6,000 - 7,000 miles before changing the oil and filter. (Mobile 1 oil filter might be a consideration.)

#3568 of 3583 Re: Did you see this article here? [wings8823] by thecardoc3

Nov 24, 2011 (1:15 pm)

Replying to: wings8823 (Nov 23, 2011 10:19 pm)
DING DING DING!!!! We have a winner!!!!
 
Ford and other automakers who now have concluded that "Full Synthetic" and/or "Semi-Synthetic" oil is synomous for today's engine libricant they should also redisign their oil filters... mainly increasing the filter volume!!! I am amazed that Ford and many other automakers have not INCREASED the size of their "pint size" small oil filters!
 
Filter size and volume play a significant role in setting a manufacturers service intervals! It doesn't matter what oil you choose, or what any lab testing of your oil states after the fact. If the filters life is exceeded your not doing your engine any good at all!

#3569 of 3583 Re: Did you see this article here? [thecardoc3] by roadburner

Nov 24, 2011 (3:32 pm)

Replying to: thecardoc3 (Nov 24, 2011 1:15 pm)
It doesn't matter what oil you choose, or what any lab testing of your oil states after the fact.
 
Let me get this straight; are you saying that a good UOA is not indicative of the efficiency/longevity of the oil filter?
I guess I should tell Blackstone that they no longer need to test for insolubles...

#3570 of 3583 Re: Did you see this article here? [thecardoc3] by shipo

Nov 24, 2011 (6:10 pm)

Replying to: thecardoc3 (Nov 24, 2011 1:15 pm)
Filter size and volume play a significant role in setting a manufacturers service intervals! It doesn't matter what oil you choose, or what any lab testing of your oil states after the fact. If the filters life is exceeded your not doing your engine any good at all!
 
Unless someone is running junk oil and doesn't change it for twenty thousand miles or more (or if the engine is already in rough shape), it is phylically impossible to "exceed the life of the filter".

#3571 of 3583 Re: Did you see this article here? [shipo] by wings8823

Nov 25, 2011 (12:54 am)

Replying to: shipo (Nov 24, 2011 6:10 pm)
Hmmm... Interesting thought. However, I personally would not agree that filter size and volume do not matter.
 
The Ford Motorcraft filter FL-500-S is small... very small.... much like the size filter found on a Honda Valkyrie. (I used to own a Valkyrie.)
 
Mobile 1 is good oil, along with their Mobile 1 Extended Performance oil. Now, with this said, Ford recommends changing the oil/filter at 5,000 miles should the "oil monitor" system stop working. This recommendation is made along with use of full or semi-synthetic oil. Wonder why Ford would recommend doing that using the motorcycle size OEM filter?
 
So, if all agree that Mobile is a good brand of oil, why is it that the Mibile 1 filter for the Ford Taurus is larger... more the size of many car or truck filters?
Obviously, size (volume) does matter for good filtering IF you take changing the oil further than what the OEM filter recommendation shows. In my case, that would be about 5,000 to 6,000 miles for my Taurus using the Motorcrat FL-500-S filter.

#3572 of 3583 Re: Did you see this article here? [roadburner] by thecardoc3

Nov 25, 2011 (4:32 am)

Replying to: roadburner (Nov 24, 2011 3:32 pm)
Let me get this straight; are you saying that a good UOA is not indicative of the efficiency/longevity of the oil filter?
 
Every oil analysis I have ever sent out has come back with levels exceeding normal amounts of wear, much of which is typically aggravated by the bypass valve in the filter (or the block in some cases) as having been forced open when the filter became too heavily loaded and therefore unfiltered oil was circulating. In otherwords, it was already too late for that consumer and their engine.
 
When a customers car comes in the door with no oil showing on the dipstick and subsequently getting to watch maybe two quarts draining from the pan and even with it being warm/hot it's still clearly thicker than what is supposed to be in there, exactly how does an oil analysis tell anything that experience hasn't already observed? Then bump the bill up another $25 for that customer? In a perfect world we could do that, but you have to recognize how that consumer is likely to react to any additional expense beyond what they think an oil change should cost. Now maybe if Blackstone would do this for free....(sarc)

#3573 of 3583 Re: Did you see this article here? [shipo] by thecardoc3

Nov 25, 2011 (4:38 am)

Replying to: shipo (Nov 24, 2011 6:10 pm)
Unless someone is running junk oil and doesn't change it for twenty thousand miles or more (or if the engine is already in rough shape), it is phylically impossible to "exceed the life of the filter".
 
Not true, not true at all and that's why the systems have bypass valves to allow unfiltered oil to flow in the event the filter becomes too restricted. In fact it only takes a small pressure differential to open the bypass valve, and high rpm combined with normal filter loading can routinely allow oil to bypass.

Messages Page 358 of 359

To POST a message, please Sign In.

Advertisement

Browse by Category

Browse by Vehicle
   View All Vehicles

Browse by Board
Browse by Topic
View All Topics

Edmunds Community

Advertisement