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Suzuki Grand Vitara vs Subaru Forester vs Hyundai Santa Fe vs Jeep Liberty vs Ford Escape vs Saturn Vue

4940 messages,  Last post on Sep 24, 2009 at 9:33 AM

You are in the Suzuki Grand Vitara/Vitara Forum. Your Hosts are steve_ & tidester

What is this discussion about? Subaru Forester, Hyundai Santa Fe, Jeep Liberty, Ford Escape, Suzuki Grand Vitara, Saturn VUE, SUV

#3332 of 4940 Oh, and add my vote to the by jaserb Oct 22, 2002 (1:58 pm)
"I won't buy another new car without ABS" list. All it takes is locking up your brakes badly one time to really mess yourself up. I did it once, and fortunately all I messed was my pants Not really, but you get the point.   -Jason
#3333 of 4940 jaserb by nippononly Oct 22, 2002 (3:32 pm)
thanks for chiming in on the SF! We had not heard until you spoke up.   And no, Subaru does not sell a model without standard ABS.
#3334 of 4940 Trailer Hitches by xccoachlou Oct 22, 2002 (6:12 pm)
I was reading a review, and I'm pretty sure it was at Car Place ( http://www.thecarplace.com ) where the reviewer, Bob Bowden, spoke of a fellow receiving serious back injury because of a trailer hitch. If I recall correctly, he was rear ended and the other vehicle slammed into his hitch, and not the bumpre. This caused the hitch and the frame to take the full brunt of the force, instead of the bumper. FWIW - Lou
#3335 of 4940 good memory by steve_ HOST Oct 22, 2002 (6:52 pm)
Here's the link to the back injury/hitch article. Btw, is the XC you coach on dirt or snow? Steve, Host
#3336 of 4940 Thanks, and it's Dirt & Mud :) by xccoachlou Oct 22, 2002 (7:09 pm)
Steve,   Thanks, you're good!   Here's the section applying to the hitch -   "The man had been driving a Jeep Cherokee, towing a work trailer with his paints and ladders, when he stopped at a traffic light and was struck from behind by a car driven by an uninsured motorist. The trailer was hit and it transferred the impact forces through its frame, to the trailer hitch on the sport ute. That hitch was not attached to the rear body of the Cherokee, of course, but to the frame of the sport ute.   The Cherokee -- like all vehicles today -- was designed to deform in an accident. But .. it was the body that would deform. And the body wasn't even damaged.   Top experts in the nation testified about how that trailer hitch did its dirty work. It absorbed none of the blow, and transferred the force into and through the frame, which buckled upward directly under the front seat area. It was as if the driver had been hit in the back by the end of a 2X4. Even at low speed, at a fast jog rate, being struck this way could -- and in this case did -- shift spinal alignment.   The man will never have a day without back pain again.   Had the Cherokee not had a trailer hitch, our plaintiff likely would not have been injured, the experts said. The rear bumper would have absorbed the low-speed impact. A trailer hitch, a national safety expert testified, is an invitation to passenger injury in any rearend wreck. In his words, the trailer hitch "ruined all the computer work on crush zones." "   It's a college team, NCAA D3, and I'm always lookin for good runners. If you've driven to some meets, you know they make you park out in the mud and dirt. I'm hoping to christen a new subie at Holmdel Park's Meet of Champions when I go recruiting there. No time for a test drive this weekend, though.   - Lou
#3337 of 4940 by steve_ HOST Oct 22, 2002 (7:13 pm)
Just curious - I'm an ex-skate skier (recreational only!). Fresh snow tends to have much better traction in the parking lots than fresh mud.   (I'm good, but google.com is better). Steve, Host
#3338 of 4940 Lou by paisan Oct 23, 2002 (3:46 am)
Interesting article. But I'll bet that since it was a "work" accident a good portion of those "back injuries" are trumped up to try to collect more from workman's compensation. Not to mention that the Cherokee is a Uni-body vehicle there is not frame on it! Was he wearing his seat belt? A lot of factors we don't see in a small snapshot about the case.   -mike
#3339 of 4940 ABS by paisan Oct 23, 2002 (3:48 am)
You can always put in a blown fuse for the ABS if you really dislike it. I for one used to hate it til it saved my butt. Now the only time I disable it is if I'm running on sand or dirt. For offroading at least on my Isuzus, anything under 10mph and the ABS will not engage, so I don't have to worry about disengaging it.   -mike
#3340 of 4940 by ateixeira Oct 23, 2002 (5:53 am)
No - Subaru does not sell any cars without ABS. Haven't for a couple of years now.   Don't forget, without ABS you'll flat spot your tires in no time. Noone can modulate their brakes perfectly, maybe we'd like to think so, but nope. Once you lock them even slightly, flat spots start developing, from that point on it'll lock up more easily, and it keeps getting worse.   The Cherokee does have a frame, it just doesn't stretch the full length of the vehicle. My Forester has a frame, too, in fact my trailer hitch bolts to the frame rails. The "unibody" part just means that the body panels act as part of the structure.   -juice
#3341 of 4940 It's more of a sub-frame by paisan Oct 23, 2002 (6:03 am)
rather than a frame per-say. The frame rails are welded to the body. On a "frame" vehicle the entire weight and all components are attached to the frame itself.   -mike

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