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Suzuki Grand Vitara vs Subaru Forester vs Hyundai Santa Fe vs Jeep Liberty vs Ford Escape vs Saturn Vue

4940 messages,  Last post on Sep 24, 2009 at 9:33 AM

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What is this discussion about? Subaru Forester, Hyundai Santa Fe, Jeep Liberty, Ford Escape, Suzuki Grand Vitara, Saturn VUE, SUV

#21 of 4940 Tribute Switch by big_guy Jan 04, 2001 (10:15 am)
The manual switch that locks the differential on the Tribute to 50/50 is only effective at low speeds. Once the vehicle gets up over 18 mph it shuts out the electronic clutch that is engaged by the switch and goes back to normal operation (i.e. 100% FWD until wheel slip occurs and then power is re directed rearward for traction).
#22 of 4940 Subaru Forester is my clear choice over Sante Fe or Tribute by sschumer Jan 06, 2001 (12:40 pm)
Earlier this week my wife and I picked up her new 2001 Subaru Forester S. I wanted to take a moment to share how pleased I was with this decision, and the positive buying experience involved. A couple of months ago I set out looking for a replacement for my wife's 1992 Honda Accord EX Wagon -- which has served us (and our two young sons, now ages 10 and 8) extremely well through 220,000 miles. We were looking to buy outright again, and the buying criteria was clear. In priority order, it was: reliability, safety -- based largely on all-wheel drive and air bags offered, cargo space, gas mileage, key features that had to include among other things a moonroof and leather interior, and price. Based on this, another Honda Accord Wagon would have hit the mark (except for the all-wheel drive). But since Honda no longer makes wagons, I began researching other small wagons and small SUV's. I spent a couple of months going through Consumer Reports, Consumer Guide, The Car Book, and a host of Internet sites that included Edmunds, Cars.com, Car and Driver.com, CarReview.com and others. What I learned was the Subaru Forester was far and away the best choice for us. It is clearly a better overall product than either the Toyota RAV-4, Honda CR-V, Mazda Tribute or Ford Escape among small SUV's. What really set the Forester apart was its consensus top-of-the-class rating by Consumer Reports, Consumer Guide and The Car Book; its proven reliability; excellent customer satisfaction; all-wheel drive from most experienced manufacturer, along with a viscous limited slip rear differential; highest HP & torque 4-cylinder engine; best-of-class crash rating; best-rated handling and ride; larger cargo space; and 60 month/60,000 mile major components warranty. Key features that were also important to us but pretty much comparable to its competition were the 4-wheel ABS & disc brakes, side impact door beams, side airbags (except the RAV-4), moonroof (except for the CR-V, which doesn't offer one and can't have one installed -- Honda says they have to remove a roof beam, which would negatively affect the structure of the car body) and leather interior, gas mileage, price, heated seats, ability to use regular gas, a full-size spare, heated power mirrors, loaner cars for overnight service while under warranty and door-to-door shuttle service thereafter . Although I have to admit even the little things -- like the de-icing front wiper, integrated window antenna, multiple storage compartments, a rubber cargo area tray, subfloor storage, a dimming rear view mirro with electronic compass, and the easiest-to-open rear door (especially when compared to the CR-V) -- were advantages over the competition as well. I never would have bought the Ford Escape or Mazda Tribute -- neither companies have good reliability records overall, and these products are in their first year of production. The President of Mazda happens to be an old friend of mine, so I knew if I wanted the Tribute I could get a great deal. It wouldn't have been worth it.   I'll also tell you we considered a few wagons -- with the Subaru Outback and Volkswagen Passat coming out on top. Here, my wife and I simply preferred the SUV-style over the Outback wagon. And while the Passat wagon is a highly-rated vehicle, to get what we got with the Forester would have meant spending an additional $4,000 to get all-wheel drive, forcing us into the 6-cylinder model with much poorer gas mileage and a requirement to use much more expensive premium gas. All in all, I can't get over the outstanding combination the Subaru Forester offers in terms of reliability, safety, features and value.   With all this, I still had just a bit of hesitation before making the final buying decision because neither my wife or I had ever owned a Subaru. This is where Al Rowe, our salesman, came in. His professionalism, knowledge and straightforwardness in dealing with both of us made the difference. In sales myself -- 20 years with IBM as a salesman, sales manager and now sales executive -- I've learned a thing or two about salesmanship and the right way to earn a customer's business. Al Rowe represented Subaru very well. We expect this to be just the start of a long-term, positive relationship with Subaru of Morristown, New Jersey as we need to service our Forester along the way -- and look for our next car!
#23 of 4940 yeah right by sasquatch_2000 Jan 08, 2001 (7:52 am)
Why do I get the feeling that the previous poster is either "salesman Al Rowe" or some other Subaru employee? This same posting appeared in at least 4 places without Subaru in the topic's title.
#24 of 4940 Defining AWD, and is the Tribute a Mazda? by ateixeira Jan 08, 2001 (9:54 am)
Both Tribute and Santa Fe have part-time AWD systems. They're aren't true 4x4s because they lack a low range. The "4WD" label is misleading, IMO. They are really FWD/part-time AWD.   They are part time because they only operate on slippery surfaces. 90% of the time they are FWD.   That is the Forester's edge. It's AWD is truly full time, wet or dry. So it acts to reduce understeer and neutralize the handling on dry pavement, which is 90% of the time. Part-time systems are by definition re-active, but the Soob is pro-active and works to prevent slip in the first place.   Despite all the clearance, C&D managed to get an Escape stuck in a recent test, and they couldn't even dig out. The Navigator saved it.   OK, none of these are intended for off road use. My Forester was great on the beaches in the Outer Banks and around the apple orchard for picking Granny Smiths. That's what these are intended for and the Forester was great.   The other point is that the Tribute isn't really a Mazda. We own two Mazdas now and would consider a Mazda SUV, but the Tribute is a Ford through-and-through. Ford Duratec engine from the Taurus with the lame and problematic Ford CD4E tranny.   If you disagree about the tranny, I'd invite you to read up on the 626 topic under Sedans. It's interesting, because the 5 speed trannies are Mazda units, and the auto for the V6 is also a Mazda unit. Only the 4 cylinder auto gets a Ford tranny, and guess which is the ONLY one with reliability problems?   To top it off, the Tribute has a bigger engine with more torque, and that tranny is being burdened with more weight to haul as well.   I personally would not gamble on the longevity of a known-bad Ford tranny.   The interior room is a big plus, and that a powerful V6 is offered is nice, but Mazda should have used the 626's engine, or even the Miller Cycle engine, along with a MANUAL transmission, and a true Mazda unit to boot.   Hyundai is an underdog and I hope they do well. The V6 should have more power, though, and it also needs to be offered with a manual tranny. Kind of funky looking but give them credit for being unique.   -juice
#25 of 4940 Ripley's Believe It or Not by sschumer Jan 08, 2001 (10:35 am)
Sasquatch, don't know whether this pleases you or not to learn, but I really have no ties to Subaru whatsoever. My story and opinions are my own. I'm an IBM worldwide sales operations executive, located at 1133 Westchester Ave, White Plains, NY. Feel free to check. My apologies for the multiple postings. I'd never posted before, thought it helpful to share my experience within the different postings that made sense. This is what my research turned up, but in the end it's just my opinion and not be taken as anything more than that. I have found it interesting so far that almost no one seems interested in debating the points I made between these vehicles, instead just assuming my bullishness for the Forester must be because I'm a Subaru mouthpiece. To each his own.
#26 of 4940 Why is my by scape2 Jan 08, 2001 (8:52 pm)
stock in IBM not performing damit! Thats ok, I'm in it for the long run I'm only 34. I have faith Big Blue will take a good turn... Back to the Forester debate. The Forester is the better "offroad" SUV when comparing to the tribute. The Foresters frame is more stout and can handle the terrain better. But, The Trib will eat a Forester for lunch on the highway, curves or hills when it comes to the road. (V6 of course). So it all comes down to your preference, road manners, or offroad manners?
#27 of 4940 by ateixeira Jan 09, 2001 (5:43 am)
Actually, on the curves I'd take the Forester's low center of gravity and 5 speed availability any day.   For the hills and long straight highway drives, the torque of the V6 ought to come in handy. What they really need to offer is a manual tranny though!   -juice
#28 of 4940 this is great...... by rplum Jan 09, 2001 (10:36 am)
This is a great thread, hopefully it keeps up, as my current pet project right now is to "benchmark" the Escape against the Forester. A 2001 RAV4 gets into the mix in mid to late February.   sschumer, thanks for your comments, SOA couldn't have said it better.   Both vehicles have their ups and downs, but it's nice to read the real world opinions.....I'm trying to spend a lot of seat time in the Escape right now.   your comments are great.....   Ryan Subaru R&D
#29 of 4940 by ateixeira Jan 09, 2001 (10:47 am)
Interesting, so we have a factory rep, eh?   We have a "Subaru Crew" under the Owners Clubs topics, and I'd like to invite you to drop in there too.   -juice
#30 of 4940 not really by rplum Jan 09, 2001 (11:37 am)
Not really a factory rep.   We just have a small office here in the US that does special research projects/requests for FHI in Japan.   We're a separate entity from SOA.   RP

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