Last post on Oct 13, 2013 at 2:53 PM
You are in the Cadillac Escalade
What is this discussion about?
Cadillac Escalade, Cadillac Escalade EXT, Cadillac Escalade ESV, SUV
#196 of 1005 It is no different..
Sep 18, 2000 (8:42 pm)
from the strategy that any profitable car company employs. The same could be said about Lexus and Toyota, Jaguar and Lincoln, Lincoln and Ford, Volkswagen and Audi, and the upcoming Porsche(Cayenne) and Volkswagen(Colorado). Platform engineering is not new, nor is it a rip off. The upgrades in engine, suspension, electrical wiring, features, and other content are worth the higher price alone. The Caddy can be perceived as a bargain, especially considering that the 2002 will offer many of the same and in some instances more specs than it's often higher priced and smaller sized rivals. I know size is subjective, but you get a whole lot of vehicle with substantial presence for the same or less than a BMW X5 4.4, ML430, or Range Rover. The new Caddy will be a run away success. It won't handle like it's smaller rivals, but it will cosset and pamper its owner in a manner that only large luxury sedans and the Lexus LX470 can rival at a price that is $20-$50K cheaper.
It will go a long way towards repositioning/reestablishing the brand with influential young influencers. Entertainers, athletes, and young executives as recently as 2 years ago would have laughed at the notion of getting a Caddy. Now, the Escalade will be in the same garages and valets of trendy hot spots parked next to 911's, S500's, S600's, CLK's, CL's, 7's, Jag's, Range Rovers, and other luxury vehicles. The Escalade will put the Caddy back in the same frame of reference as those vehicles. That is a significant development that further validates GM's decision to create Cadillac versions of their SUV's/Trucks. The result will be younger customers more open to the possibility of seriously considering other Caddy products like the Evoq and Imag. That will be a serious win for Caddillac and American Luxury in general.
Sep 22, 2000 (2:34 pm)
The new Escalade will be a run away failure, not success, just like the current one.
GM wants Cadillac to compete with the best the SUVs in the world. The Escalade just doesn't cut the mustard. All it does is reinforce the long-standing image of Cadillac being a huge "soft," American luxury barge, with little in the way of technical or engineering innovation. It is no way, state-of-the-art, or cutting edge.
Where's the 5-speed automatic transmission? Where's the Northstar engine? Where's the independent rear suspension? Where's the fold into-the-floor third rear seat? What happened to the low range in the transfer case? It used to be there! Okay, so it's got the On-Star system. Big deal.
The Japanese and especially the Europeans are light years ahead of Cadillac when it come to innovation.
If this is the "Best" GM can offer, the future's for GM is not looking great. And, as usual, Cadillac is the follower -- not the leader.
#198 of 1005 rsholland
Sep 27, 2000 (9:14 pm)
Wow! I never met someone quite like you. Well thought out post RS. Too bad you are wrong on so many levels. No Northstar? It is very tough to re-engineer the best engine in the world to a rear wheel drive model instead of front. Third seats? Like the useless ones in the Durango and the Navigator? Have you actually sat in one? If yes, how tall are you? 3'7"? I for one am glad they didn't. I do agree with you on one point. It is a tahoe. I am sorry to all the 99 and 00 escalade owners, but it is true. Forget the fact that everything is standard on the caddy like the front and rear heated seats, the nicer leather, the best suspension using Bilstien shocks, the free onstar, the longer warranty, the 7 disc cd changer, the Bose radio, the built in TV and VCP, and the body cladding. Never mind the fact that there are certain perks because it is a Cadillac and not a Chevy. The only thing Cadillac did wrong with this truck is bring it out after the Navigator. Now, when the 02's hit the ground, I would be interested to see what you think of it? Seeing as it will blow everything else in the market away with standard equipment like the 345 HP motor, Stabilitrac, Auto leveling, rear air AND a sunroof (try getting that in any other sport utility), your third row fold away rear seats, and keep the price about the same. But, like I said RS, you are entitled to your opinions regardless of how wrong they are.
Sep 27, 2000 (9:17 pm)
Sorry, that should have been address to RSHolland and Mrzang. Mrzang is the fool who thinks the Caddy is a tahoe marked up 15 grand. My apologies RS.
Sep 28, 2000 (6:05 pm)
It figures. Your response is typical of Caddy owners who always seem to be in denial.
Where's the 5-speed automatic that Acura, Mercedes and BMW have?
Where's the IRS that Acura, Lexus RX300, Mercedes and BMW have?
Where's the split folding-into-the-floor third rear seat the Acura MDX has?
Lincoln is NOT the target. Mercedes, BMW, Acura and Lexus are, if you want to be considered "world-class." All those brands offer more "high-tech" engineering than does the Escalade.
Yes, I have seen and read about the new 2002 Escalade. It doesn't impress.
Sep 28, 2000 (9:00 pm)
I for one like the image of a large american SUV. BE it either one, they have more interior space, more power, better looks (in my opinion) and just the right status implied on people who I know. If you like the Smaller import SUV's then please state so in their own forums. (I own a 4 runner) I don't like it very much. But this isn't the place for that.
Sep 28, 2000 (9:44 pm)
This is a discussion board, not a fan club. That means both positive and negative opinions are welcome.
My point is this: Cadillac and Lincoln are supposed to be the best that America can offer in terms of luxury, engineering, whatever... They've got the luxury end nailed. Always have. But that's it. Period. Both Cadillac and Lincoln cars are finally starting to make inroads as being considered "world class." The SUVs have a long way to go before achieving that status.
I am willing to bet anyone, that when we start reading comparison tests (be it Consumer Reports, Edmund's or the auto/SUV buff books) between the Escalade and the other "premium" SUVs, that the Escalade will continue to be at, or near, the bottom. It will be good at being luxurious -- which is a given. It will be middle-of-the-road to poor in all other areas of performance. I'm talking about all around performance, not just what 345 HP can do in a straight line.
If you like GM's definition of what a luxury SUV should be, fine. I don't, and will continue to speak out. If that offends you, too bad.
Sep 29, 2000 (2:44 am)
Well, I agree with Gaskins and ttcad here.
The only thing Caddy did wrong was wait too long to enter the luxury truck market. They admit to that, know they are behind, and as such are about to introduce several hot new SUVs over the course of the next 3 years (and beyond if the market still demands).
The first generation Escalade makes no apologies for being an upgraded Denali. The Navigator, LX470, QX4, and several others are upgraded models of lesser "sister" vehicles. Why a large number of people seem to point out the Escalade for its lesser roots, as if it's the only vehicle of its kind to have such a lineage, I do not understand.
The current Escalade has already brought in younger buyers to Cadillac showrooms, and yes, including enough people in the entertainment industry to be relevant and countable. He'll remain nameless here, but I have a relative in the entertainment industry in his low 30's who bought an Escalade and could afford essentially any damn vehicle he wants. He chose the Escalade...a Cadillac.
Regarding the Edmunds review of the new '02 Escalade, given that these guys have seemingly gone out of their way to find things wrong with any other Cadillac they have tested and written about, the fact that they were so impressed with the new Escalade that they say it is equal to, if not better than, the other luxury SUVs, both import and domestic, speaks volumes. Frankly, I was amazed when I read it, and excited, since the '02 Escalade really represents the first of the "new breed" of Cadillac vehicles that will begin to be introduced for the '02 model year.
Anyway, as of now all we can do is speculate as to how the consumer market will react to the new '02 Escalade. I have a feeling that we'll be seeing a lot more Escalades hitting the road, and a lot of them will be "suped up" with aftermarket goodies that'll make them look even hotter. This will be a very profitable vehicle for Cadillac, and it will set new standards in many areas for the large luxury SUV market.
Competition is good. All of us consumers win in the end.
Like it or not, Cadillacs are becoming cool again.
Sep 29, 2000 (2:21 pm)
You've made a number of valid points. Excellent post.
Your comments regarding the Navigator, LX470, QX4, are absolutely true. You can also add the Acura STX to that list. I'm not a fan of those models either. I don't like "badge engineering" in any way, shape or form. You can argue, and rightfully so, that this is the easiest, cheapest and quickest way to bring a new model to market. The problem is -- no matter how much you dress it up -- you still end up with a mediocre product -- because its roots (which you can't change) are mediocre to begin with.
Of those other badge-engineered vehicles I have hope (strong hope) for the next Navigator, which is due out in a couple of years. From what I've read so far, it will have many of the features the current models "should" have right now.
The excellent 2002 Explorer is a good tip-off as to what you can expect to find on the next Navigator. It will have virtually all the items (that I feel should be there) that are currently missing from the current Navigator, Escalade, etc. It will have IRS, a roomy, easy-to-access and fold-away third seat, and most likely a 5-speed automatic. All of these features will make it a class-leading vehicle. Yes the next Expedition will also have many, if not all those features. The difference is that the next Navigator will start off using a much more sophisticated platform to begin with.
Sep 29, 2000 (5:57 pm)
I have to apologize for the earlier post. To come out attacking was wrong. I guess I was just having a bad day.
The only real problem I see with your conclusion is that you are comparing vehicles that were built off of car chassis. The ML is a product of the E class. The X5 is a tall 5 series. What would happen if they but bigger tires on an STS and called it an SUV? No one could come close to the technology. I have driven (BTW, I am not an owner of a Cadillac, I run a dealership) all the inports for a good spin. I have to say that I do like the trucks. I use the term truck VERY loosely though. After all, they are still just big, tall cars. When the new 02 escalade hits, the technology will be greater than anything else out there. Stabilitrac in a sport ute?!? So they won't have a 5 speed tranny. Being able to pull 8700 pounds in complete luxury and safety doesn't require 5 gears. Besides, for the most part, the only thing a 5 speed does for you is give you more torque off the line because of the lower gear ratio in first. Not really needed.
I can say that interest in the vehicle is tremondous and Cadillac is accomodating that. I currently have 6 orders for them. All at list plus (whatever it might be). One of the orders is for a gentleman that had to extend the lease on his current escalade 6 months. This is unheard of on a GMAC lease. 2 month extensions are usually the most. Cadillac expects big things with this new one. So do I.
Again, I have to apologize for the scathing post earlier. As most people here such as Robh knows, I don't like to do that. Everyone has, and is entitled to, their own opinions.