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Pickups Pickups - Archived Discussions Toyota TACOMA vs Ford RANGER - VI 
632 messages, Last post on Jun 25, 2000 at 2:12 PM
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"I do not disagree with your statments, however my question is on the designation of hundreds of thousands of acres of NEW wilderness areas. All by executive order, NOT the will of the people effected. " Wrong. The people have spoken. Do you think Clinton has created these areas just for the heck of it? NO. I and hundreds of thousands of others have mailed him asking him to start the roadless initiative, and to creat the new Monuments. For the Roadless Initiative ALONE, Clinton got 800,000 letters in favor of it. This was in the FIRST comment period, last year. The country has also shown OVERWHELMING support for his National Monument Designations. The only people crying out are the extremists, such as Helen Chenoweth of Idaho, the Colorado "republican" delegation, and Don "Oil-corrput" Young of Alaska. Guess what Cspousner: The National Forests and Parks are EVERYONES lands, not just the people that live next to them. It's high time you understood and recognized that. |
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Support the Roadless Initiative Recently, Mike Dombeck Chief of the USFS, proposed the Roadless Initiative. This plan would protect the remaining roadless areas in our national forests from roadbuilding and logging. Currently, 99.2 percent of the lower 48 is roaded. That leaves .8 percent that is not. And only half of that .8 percent is protected. Right now, 16 percent of our national forest land base is protected wilderness. The rest is open to motors and logging. These new proposed roadless areas total 41 million acres. They would be protected from logging and roadbuilding. They would allow Off road vehicle use. This would bring balance to the national forest, adding to the 16 percent and preserving around 25 percent of our national forests from logging and roadbuilding. This is it, this is the last of the roadless areas. There are no more in the lower 48. There are 380,000 miles of roads in our national forests, enough to get to the moon and back, and more than our entire interstate system. These areas would not be official protected wilderness, but they would be protected from logging and roadbuilding. People who enjoy offroad motor sports WILL be allowed in proposed areas. There is a public comment period open RIGHT NOW that ends June 17th. The Forest Service is asking for your comments on the issue. Here is alink with a national map showing our remaining roadless areas: http://www.wilderness.net/nwps/map.cfm Come on and show your support for our remaining wildlands. If you want to read a plethora of information on this subject, you can go to the USFS Roadless Initiative website: http://roadless.fs.fed.us/ If your mind is made up, you can just copy this statement (or write your own)and send it by email to the USFS email adress at: roadlessdeis  fs.fed.usThis is the part to copy: I support the FULL protection of the inventoried roadless areas in the Roadless Initiative. This means I support zero logging and roadbuilding in the proposed roadless areas. The national forest system is out of balance. Thank you for your time. (then add name, street address) ------------ Thanks people! |
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I own an Xtracab TRD 4WD V6 Toyota Tacoma. I love it... Lot price was about 25500 and I got it for about 22800. The dealer agreed to take a 1000 profit on this vehicle after I pointed out that they had only had it for one week and they had 4 others at the time. The vehicle feels like one large, coherent mass, sort of like the whole thing was carved out of one big chunk of metal. The TRD offroad (and others?) suspension is a bouncy, sometimes wild ride, but I enjoy this. Weird. That's my scoop for any prospective buyers. As for the "other" convsersations going on here? Like hug the trees and kiss the yellow-bellied sap-sucker? I highly doubt whether any of you really know what you are talking about or even live the lives you portray on this board. Most likely you are parroting what you thought was kewl from people who intentionally dress up like Mad Max and who are just smart enough to fool you into idolizing them. That's all. My two cents. You will know who you are if you find my comments a personal insult or hard to believe. |
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| figured I better chime in on this nature vs. motors debate. I live in MN, and love the outdoors: skiing, fishing, offroading, hiking, etc. If you're into canoeing, you've probably heard of the Boundary Waters Canoe Area in extreme northeastern Minnesota. -probably the best canoe area in the country. there is a push right now to allow motorized boats into the boundary waters area, which currently allows only canoes except for just a handful of lakes. I think that sucks. We have over 15,000 lakes in MN; 95% of which you can take a motorized boat on. In this country of fast-paced, high tech, urban sprawl, there should be a greater emphasis on keeping our few wilderness areas like the Boundary Waters protected from motors and such. I guess this really isn't a unique arguement as most would probably agree with me, but I felt like I had to vent a bit. -eagle63 | |
| Dude, I had a friend who had a "large coherent mass" he had to have major surgery to have it removed. LOL!!!!! | |
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What exactly are these "portrayed lives"? Is it owning and using a truck or enjoying the outdoors? Is it going outside and snowmobiling or canoeing? Are you so wrangled to a computer or video game or something that you find it impossible to believe that people actually do things OUTSIDE??? Try wiping the cheetos off of your shirt, pry the yourself away from the TV, and go out the door into the big scary OUTSIDE! |
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Semaphore, sort of like your really going to get full use out of the locker in your TRD? LOL!! Sorry bud, but in order to get full use of this option your going to have to go way, way, way out into the woods, hills, whatever to use this locker the way it was intended to be used, Oh, that also includes your suspension. By the way Enjoy your 4K sticker that says, TRD Toyota Racing Development... LOL!! By the way, I do live in the NW, about 45 minutes from MT Hood. A little geography lesson, MT Hood is in the Cascade Range, along with MT ST Helens, Rainer, Jefferson, 3 sisters... I visit the Cascades with my Ranger about 4 times a month.. and use my 4x4 as it was intended to be used.... See you in the hills.. |
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"I and hundreds of thousands of others have mailed him asking him to start the roadless initiative, and to create(i did a spelling correction for you here) the new Monuments." You and the others DO NOT know what is best for the state of Colorado and Utah, states that HAD STARTED to put in place measures to have JOINT use of the lands. If the condition of forest/land use in ILL. is your strongest suit, you fail to convince me. Do not ruin my state. An article in todays Rocky Mountain News totally supports my position on forest mismanagement. It cites 100 years of mismanagement by the people suppose to PROTECT the forests has placed them in a position of exploding into fire storms. The title is "Thick Forests Certain To Burn Again. Century of management aimed at avoiding fire leaves conditions ripe for more conflagarations" I quote: "Small fires once rid the froests of..." this is the KEY phrase I was trying to get across so read closely... "...dead wood on the ground and thinned the number of trees. They also created openings that acts as natural fire breaks. But after a century of suppressing fires, Colorado forests are a vast expanse of flammable trees, packed crown to crown, with few openings. They are an easy mark for disease, which leaves behind dry dead trees." Ever see what pine beetle does to a forest? Ever see 10,000 acres of downed spruce like is sitting off Rabbit Ears Pass right now? I continue: "We have these interconnected forests without openings and now we have people building houses in these areas." said Becky Oarmenter, wildlife biologist ant the US Froest Servise's Boulder District. "Now we have a true safety issue on our hands." "State and federal officials say they want to restore balance to the forest by cutting down some trees, setting controlled fires or both. Two demonstration projects were being redied even before the latest fires." But my other point is you do not set these fires when the wind is blowing 70 mph as in NM and the Sand Dunes where in excess of 15,000 acres were burned up. The article goes on to cite the San Isable Nat. Forest as one of the demonstration projects. Even though it is very dry, that forest has not burned. I drive thru the San Isable, Pike, Roosevelt and other National Forests and there are ALWAYS signs in these areas that boldly state "No Motorized vehicles beyond this point". I do not know where spoog gets his figures on 380,000 miles of roads but the San Isable, which is a VERY large forest, only has 800 miles of roads AND trails. I do not know the exact number of acres in the 9, count them 9 wilderness areas in the San Isable NF alone but I stopped counting at 200 sq miles which is 130,000 acres. First I think, no, I KNOW spoogs numbers are fudged. Second, setting aside 130,000 acres in ONE national forest is quite a bit for the few hundred, maybe a thousand wilderness visitors, leaving maybe 2/3 of the rest of the forest for the tens of thousands of campers, 4 wheelers, ATV'ers, snow mobilers. The national forest here have signs "Land of many uses". Spoog and perhaps others seem to want to change that to something like "Land of one use, vehicle use restricted after sign". You think I do not care about the environment? Heck, I shed tears almost looking down at the high density housing in Highlands Ranch, knowing that just 10 years ago cattle grazed, antelope ran there, buffalo grazed there. Until a California developer that ruined Orange county came in and subdivided lots for houses 10-15 feet apart for as far as the eye can see. That is sad. eagle: I do not disagree about keeping the wilderness areas nor have I suggested getting rid of some of those areas NOR have I said do not make any new areas. The vastness of the grab by people who cannot manage what they have is part of my beef. |
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with 4 wheel drive Rangers, Tacomas, what ever in a smaller area the result is MORE damage. Lets just for argument say there are 1,000 visitors to the 130,000 (ext) acres in the 9 wilderness areas of the San Isabel. That average is 130 acres per person. Now when I travel a 20 mile 4X4 road, which is 10 feet wide, what do I get to use, maybe 60 acres total? Bu I am sharing with thousands. That is the whacko's idea of fair. |
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differing oppinions and nobody gets too hurt. first point : skiers: an intermediate skier (skied at least 20 times) CANNOT Ski in avalanche prone terain. Many advanced skiers have a hard time skiing 35 degree terain with a foot of powder on top of it. anyone who has stood on top of a chute like that will attest that it scares the bejesus out of you. if a resort has terain like this there are signs warning you of potential death. intermediate skiiers DO not VENTURE there trust me. Rescue Costs: I Pay for a wilderness permit that covers rescues.. he!! i pay taxes for rescues.. I personally accept i take my life in my own hands when i ski. If i die i die doing something i love, if we could all be so lucky. and rescues are nothing compared to how much we spend on building roads in the moutains. or plowing roads... or maintaining roads. my oppinion the more wilderness areas the better. i would be happy if they let NO one in .. People have the rest of the world, let nature have its own little place too.. |
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