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Pickups Pickups - Archived Discussions Extended cabs OK for "real" people 
83 messages, Last post on Sep 12, 1998 at 5:41 PM
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Mike, You just saw the reason trucks are selling like toys at the holidays - they are being promoted as car replacements when they probably shouldn't be. Full size trucks are far from car replacements; they are heavy duty work vehicles that are worthless without a need for their capacity. It's like a single guy buying a 5 bedroom house. Yes, it's a place to live, but really unnecessary. Chevy is even trying to convince police departments to buy the 4 door Tahoe SUV since they don't make the Caprice anymore. This is FAR from a direct replacement vehicle. |
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"Full size trucks ........... are heavy duty work vehicles that are worthless without a need for their capacity." Boy, that sure sound like a narrow-minded viewpoint. I confess, my pickup is in that category about 99 percent of the time, maybe more. And I suspect that most other pickups are too. If every pickup owner had to prove the vehicle is being used only for heavy-duty work in order to continue owning it, I don't think this conference would exist because there wouldn't be very many pickups in this country. |
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lwf, A little narrow minded, maybe, but think about 20 years ago when almost EVERY pickup was used for work. What did you have then? Rugged slabs of steel, big block V8s, drivetrains with some teeth. Were there only a few? Heck no, Ford sold 500-700K of them back in the seventies too. What do you have now? Trucks trying to replace cars, according to the ad Mike saw. I'm not saying I don't appreciate a comfortable seat and a few niceties, but don't market them as "cars" when they're not. Think about all the complaints you hear when people trade in their mid-size family car for a pickup or SUV - BAD fuel economy, rough ride, the high climb to get in, tight back seats. People are buying trucks today with the impression they are comparable vehicles to what they're getting out of. You don't have to prove a truck's worth to anyone but yourself. If you know that you haul or tow regularly or if you off-road every weekend, yeah, you need a truck. But if you use the benefits of a truck only a handful of times in a year, then you probably could get the job done with a well-chosen car. |
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I think we had this discussion somewhere else. Why do people buy Corvettes? Nobody needs that kind of power. And how efficient is two seats? And where do you put your groceries? And who needs to blow that kind of money and gas? And why are they polluting the environment more than they need to? Obviously, all Corvette owners should drive Honda Civics. Less expensive, better mpg, plenty of power for every day needs, more cargo room, more passenger capacity, etc. And let's outlaw the big caddy's and towncars. Minivans and station wagons are more reasonable choices. It's just not a valid argument. Vehicle ownership goes far beyond actual needs. What do you feel most comfortable driving? What sacrifices are you willing to make to drive that vehicle? That is the vehicle you should buy. If it's a pickup you want, then it is a pickup you should buy. The more pickups that are bought, the more competion for consumers there will be and the more improved the product will be. A pickup truck is still a heck of a bargain when compared to SUVs, and a lot of other vehicles. |
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Good responses. I was a little hesitant at posting that last one thinking it might start an argument, but so far it didn't. But I'm a little defensive on this topic because I get a lot of this "why in the world do you own a pickup" stuff, and I don't consider mine to be worthless just because I don't need it as a work vehicle. Brutus' post said almost everything I might have, but his last sentence is especially on target. In addition, I don't consider pickups to be expensive to own and operate. I haven't had a major breakdown in the about 300,000 miles I've logged in my trucks, and the fuel economy of my current F150 is as good or better than that of all of the "full-sized" cars I owned up until the 70s. And the cars were always in need of front-end alignments as evidenced by tow-in/tow-out tire wear; whereas, my pickups have never needed them. Once upon a time one could do a little towing with a big car, and I did too, but after I tried doing it with a truck, I never gave a thought to a full-sized car again. Now it's academic, however, because there aren't any more full-sized cars that can be used for occasional towing. So if the big 3 are finally trying to convice the general public that a pickup might be a good alterntive to a car, all I can say is how come it took them 25 years to figure that one out? And then, of course, there's the topic of retaining value. I doubt if the guy down the street will keep his recently acquired, approximately $35,000-to-$40,000 Lexus for 10 years like I'll keep my $20,000 pickup, but if he does I have an idea I'll get a better resale price than he will. |
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I'd have to agree with Brutus. My dad bought a 1970 Chevrolet 1/4 ton brand new, and still owns it. He uses it as his "around town" vehicle, and it has about 120,000 miles on it (the truck hardly leaves the city limits where he lives). Had used it to haul tools (he moonlighted as a carpenter), to tow a boat. The truck simply won't die -- then again, when he bought it, my mom told him it would be the last truck he would buy new. Looks like my son will get it when he's 16 (he's 9 now). I owned a small pickup (Isuzu) about 10 years ago, and used it for small hauling jobs. Sold it when my son was born, since there wasn't any room for the three of us. Trucks are definately a statement of lifestyle, and for single folks or married couples without kids, they're probably fine. But, if you have a family, you're better off in a car or <gasp!> minivan. SUV's? Only if you're going to use them as intended, ie off road. Bad weather is NOT enough of a reason to drive a $35K, 4 wheel drive station wagon that gets 15 MPG (if you're lucky). My .02. |
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Oops, in rereading my post (after sending it), I guess I'm NOT agreeing with Brutus. Sorry about that. |
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Brutus You hit on one key marketing factor - pickups are less expensive. A lot of single people in their early 20s are buying mini-trucks because they're cheaper than the average econobox. The mindset changes when they're ready to move up. If you had an econobox, you move up to the next size car with very little loss in mpg, and a moderate gain in utility. When you move from an S10 to a C/K, you take a big hit in economy, and these days, a large hit in price - 1500s/150s are regularly going out the door for $26K, 25/35 series trucks don't blink at the $30-35K mark. Major jump from the $10K stripped Ranger, when car sizes are stepped only a few thousand bucks each size. SUVs and minivans are way overpriced today - I have seen minivans stickered higher than my Ram 3500 (Cummins, 4x4, loaded)... unless you have a lot of kids, I don't see any reason for buying a minivan, and like Mike said, SUVs are no catch-all solution for bad-weather driving. Every year, somebody blows by me on a snow-covered road in a Grand Cherokee, and I watch them slide like fools when they come up on a slow car or a traffic signal. I think we (Brutus, lwf, myself) all agree that a truck may suit "us", because we do use the truck's capabilities, but for someone like Mike, a truck should be investigated thoroughly before dropping the big bills for one, rather than going with the crowd and buying one anyway. |
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In Alaska, we always saw 4wd vehicles in the ditches along the highway. First time 4wd owners overestimate how well their vehicles will react to lane changes, etc. on an icy highway at highway speeds. But they learn. By the way, I didn't opt for the ABS. The trucks come stock with rear wheel ABS, but I'm not even sure I like that. I understand about the control factor, but I don't think that applies to ice. Call me old fashion, but I'm use to tapping the brakes on ice when I need to come to a quick stop. When the ABS clicks in, it throws off the rhythm of my braking pattern. |
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I'm not against SUV's or pickups (I've owned one of each in the past), I just have a problem with people buying them for the wrong reasons (to wit: everyone else has them). When I owned my Trooper, I bought it to take off road. I had relatives who would go out and get their vehicles (Ford Ranger and Jeep Cherokee) dirty, and I wanted to join them. Yes, it was great having the extra room when my son was born, but getting 15MPG during the week wasn't any fun. I've seen lots of articles around the country about people who buy 4WD vehicles and then think they own the world when the weather turns bad. Bigger vehicles means more mass which usually means longer distances to stop, turn, etc. (remember that concept called physics?) Now, a small pickup or SUV that gets decent (not econobox) mileage may make sense for single people or couples without kids, or when there is already a vehicle available for the family (in my case, my wife's Escort). But, like folks have been saying here, it makes sense to have the right reason for owning a full-size pickup (towing, hauling) -- not for carting around the wife and kids. |
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