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Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Honda Odyssey Prices Paid and Buying Experience
21039 messages, Last post on Nov 22, 2008 at 12:20 PM
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Ok, I also posted this message on another board (the Sienna vs. Odyssey board), but I thought I'd post here are well to maximize my feedback. So here's my cut and pasted post: As many others, we're currently torn between the 2005 Sienna and the 2005 Odyssey. Specifically, we're comparing the Sienna XLE, package # 7 (which includes the DVD and CD changer) with the Odyssey EX-L with the DVD (but NO navigation). My sister recently bought the 2005 Odyssey Touring, so we've driven the Odyssey more extensively than the Sienna, but we don't really notice a major handling difference. We're satisfied with how both cars drive (although I was slightly less comfortable in the Sienna's driver's seat -- shocking, given how adjustable both the seat and the steering wheel are -- you'd think I'd have been able to find a comfy position). To us, the major differences are as follows: we'd get a potential 8th seat with the Odyssey. Yes, I recognize that it's a tight fit for 3 people, and probably not a very comfortable ride. We'd only use the seat for carpooling kids or taking short local drives (to restaurants or sightseeing locally) when we want to avoid having to take 2 cars and we're with another family or member of our own extensive family. Going into the search, we'd decided we wanted the 8th seat (not realizing we couldn't get it on the Sienna). You cannot get the XLE with an 8th seat (incidentally, you can't get the Touring model of the Odyssey with the 8th seat, either). And if you DO decide to get the LE with the 8th seat, you lose the captain's chairs (and have to special order to get the car with leather, since that model doesn't ordinarily come with leather). Aside from the 8th seat issue, the XLE Sienna will have a power tailgate, and the EX-L Odyssey won't. The XLE Sienna has pop-out third row windows, and the EX-L Odyssey windows don't do anything. We shopped every dealer in the Philadelphia area to get prices and then called our local VA dealers to see the difference. Philadephia is cheaper -- our bottom line prices: Sienna XLE, package 7 = $32,000 (inclusive of all dealers costs -- we pay only tax and tags in addition to that price). Odyssey EX-L with DVD = $30,875. The Virginia dealers we talked to (and I talked to about 10 from each manufacturer) flatly told us they couldn't beat those prices and that we should buy the car in PA. Given that we don't see much of a difference in the cars (we're neither Honda nor Toyota loyal), we'd probably go with the cheaper car (you should have a reason you'd want to pay about $1500 more for a car, right?). But here's the rub -- it's coming down to the dealership. Our driveway has a really steep grade, and the Honda Odyssey has a very low clearance. My sister, with the touring model, makes it up my driveway, but it's REALLY close. The Touring model has 17.5 inch wheels. The EX-L comes with 16 inch wheels. The PA dealership is bending over backwards to convince me it's the same clearance (they measured 6 points under the car, and took extensive time explaining things like "suspension drop" to me). They cannot, however, locate official information from Honda regarding the clearance difference (if any) between the two cars. So, the obvious thing we need to do to feel comfortable is to drive the EX-L up the driveway. While I was still away, my husband went to Pohanka Honda in Fredericksburg VA and asked to test drive an EX-L up our driveway (we live 13 miles from the dealership). Because I'd put a deposit (refundable) on a car in Philly, my husband felt compelled to tell the dealership that (believe me, I had a lot to say about his decision to do that, but it's all water under the bridge now). The dealership told him he couldn't test drive the car -- that all 4 Odysseys they currently had in stock had appointments to be test driven. HA. Right. I realize that this dealer knew the profit wasn't going to go into his own pocket, but you would hope (1) they would want to please us to get our service and (2) they would show a higher loyalty to corporate Honda -- after all, I'm sure their franchise agreement requires them to sell Honda cars, not to first ensure that the Honda profit goes into that particular dealership's pocket. And of course, there's the fact that if they gave us the lowest price we probably WOULD go with them -- most buyers, you would think, test drive the cars and then shop around to get the best possible price. We just happened to know that they couldn't beat the PA price in advance (still, I wouldn't have been quite as forthcoming as my husband -- don't get me started). So here we are -- still not QUITE sure that the EX-L fits up our driveway, and pretty annoyed with the local dealership who would most conveniently service our car. The Toyota dealership here has been great (and is very conveniently located), but we'd still have to pay more for a car that, in the end doesn't really give us more. The salesperson sent my husband home with a Sienna and let him keep it at the house, try it up the driveway and in the garage. Ironic, really, since we were never really concerned about the Sienna clearance. But what good will that dealership has garnered, especially in light of how frustrated I am with Pohanka Honda. Does anyone have any solid information about the Honda clearance -- touring model vs EX-L? There's another Honda dealership a little further from us that we could try to hit up for a test drive . . . And how annoyed would you have to be to pay $1500 more for a car (don't get me wrong, I really like the Sienna too, it's just a bit more expensive and I'm trying to rationalize that -- I'm pretty angry with Honda . . .but $1500 worth of angry? hmmmm) . . . . |
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Replying to: batball (Jul 24, 2005 5:50 am) |
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Replying to: briley (Jul 07, 2005 5:05 pm) |
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Replying to: loveyalions05 (Jul 24, 2005 8:24 am) Mud. |
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Replying to: muddyriverduck (Jul 25, 2005 6:48 am) Moreover, I am sure that Pohanka's franchise agreement requires them to do their best to sell Honda products. So if you think there are ethics problems on my side, you should recognize that there are some clear ethics issues on the dealer side as well. I am shopping for a Honda product, and I haven't decided whether it's going to work for us. Why is it you feel that this salesperson shouldn't have serviced us? Because he (and we) knew his dealership couldn't give us the best price? You're basically saying that it's ok that the salesman is motivated PURELY by his self-interest. That's not right in my book -- he's been paid by Honda to sell Honda products. His salary and HIS business ethics should keep him from thinking about his pocketbook all the time. If you think I should be more concerned with the Honda employee's pocketbook than my own, your opinion of business ethics is simply more generous toward the salesperson. I'm simply not that magnanimous. Given that we are STILL deciding between the Sienna and the Odyssey, as a HONDA employee, that salesperson should have been doing his best to ensure we ended up in his company's product. A good salesperson should be doing whatever he or she can do to sell their product. Commission should hardly be the only motivating factor. A good customer is going to reward the salesperson who gives the best customer service AND who gives the best price. Pohanka Honda gave us neither, and went a long want toward souring me toward Honda in general. Did you miss the part where I said we're now seriously considering the Sienna when we really preferred the Odyssey -- I HAVE TO KNOW WHETHER THAT CAR WILL FIT UP MY DRIVEWAY, and from my point of view, Honda is not putting me in a position where I can get that done. Your personal insults do nothing to resolve my dilemma -- do you happen to have the information regarding the clearance difference between the Touring Ody and the EX-L?
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Replying to: loveyalions05 (Jul 25, 2005 7:17 am) |
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Replying to: batball (Jul 24, 2005 5:50 am)
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Replying to: muddyriverduck (Jul 25, 2005 6:48 am)
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Replying to: tommy_2q (Jul 25, 2005 1:52 pm) |
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Based on your name it sounds like you are a fellow PSU Alum. We recently purchased an Odyssey from Lehigh Valley Honda (60 miles north of Philly) because the northern VA dealers wouldn't budge on price. One northern VA dealer even insisted on the typical add on paraphernalia. We received a similar deal as the post in 10154. It was actually an enjoyable experience working with the sales people and the sales manager from Lehigh Valley Honda. Check the clearances: The two points that would hit the ground would be either the front or rear overhang since you indicated your driveway is steep. If you had indicated your driveway has a large hump then the undercarriage would be susceptible to hitting the high spot. Take a tape measure and measure the height of the front and rear overhangs from the street on your sister's Odyssey. Then take the same measurements on on EX model on a dealer's lot. Make sure the tires are properly inflated on both vehicles. Then cut 2 pieces of foam that are the same thickness as the difference in heights between the 2 vehicles. One will be the thickness for the rear overhang and the other the thickness of the front overhang. My guess is each piece of foam should be about 3/4". Tape these foam pieces on the low point of each overhang on the Touring model. The bottom of the foam now represents the low points for the EX model. Drive up and down the incline and see if the foam scrapes. If the foam does touch the ground then even the Touring with 17.5" wheels could be susceptible to scraping based on: - how many passengers are in the van - how much other weight is in the van - if the tires are under inflated - the speed at which the incline is encountered - the angle at which the vehicle approaches the incline. Use of a demo and a sales person's time: Not sure if it works this way at all Honda dealers but at some dealers (LV Honda included) Honda owns the demonstrator and not the dealer. However if I had no intention of buying a vehicle from a dealer, for whatever reason and that includes if I knew they won't compete on price, I wouldn't consume any time from their sales staff nor would I ask to use the demo. My belief is it's not the sales person making the decision to not compete on price so let the sales staff spend their time on prospective leads to earn their income. They also deserve to have the full use of the demo in this process. Good luck with your shopping and with your decision. Vince
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